The Punishment of Kim Davis Continues

Someone needs to teach the LGBT lobby how to be gracious in victory. You would think, after decades of fighting for gay marriage, these activists would be thrilled to finally be able to legally wed in every American state. Following one of the most disturbing Supreme Court decisions in history, conservatives had but one tiny consolation: At least now we could stop hearing about this crap for a while. But of course we were only lying to ourselves.

With their unforgiving war on Rowan County, Kentucky clerk Kim Davis, the LGBT lobby and their partners in the ACLU have made their agenda clear. This isn’t just about the legalization of gay marriage. This is about making sure that every damn person in America recognizes, respects, and participates in gay marriage. And whether you’re a government employee, a small business owner, or the CEO of an international chain of fast food restaurants, they are going to see that you comply.

Poor Kim Davis. This woman is no fame-seeker. Does she look like someone who wants to be plastered all over national headlines? This woman is trying her hardest to do her job without betraying her faith. What did it earn her? A six day jail sentence. Gays and straights alike can now get marriage licenses through the Rowan County office, but Davis’ critics are furious at the way she’s modified the forms.

Unwilling to have her name associated with the licenses, Davis confiscated those issued by the office and replaced them with licenses that say they were issued “pursuant to federal court order.” Davis has said this is a compromise she can live with, but her enemies in the gay army aren’t about to leave her an out.

“The adulterated marriage licenses received by Rowan County couples will effectively feature a stamp of animus against the LGBT community, signaling that, in Rowan County, the government’s position is that LGBT couples are second-class citizens unworthy of official recognition and authorization of their marriage licenses but for this Court’s intervention and Order,” ACLU lawyers said in a written complaint to the court.

They want Judge David Bunning to order Davis to reissue the original licenses. If she refuses, they want him to put her office in receivership and appoint a clerk who will carry out their demands. At press time, no decision had yet been rendered.

What, honestly, is the harm in allowing Davis this small compromise? Are we not all Americans, trying to get through this life the best we can? Why is the gay lobby so eaten up with vengeance and fascism? Is this really the best way to win over a nation of religious objectors?

But it doesn’t seem they care about winning anyone over. They have their victory, and now they are dancing in the endzone. They want to shove their win in your face and dare you to say something about it.

Gay Sharia is here, it’s queer, and it is just as obnoxious as you thought it would be.

 

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1,689 comments

  1. We could have won the Panama war if we just had the will.

  2. My Christian faith says Kim Davis is a law breaker and should adhere to what she agreed to upon her release from the pokey
    She’s breaking the law of the United States of America nd I find it an afront to God fearing, law abiding citizens of the greatest country God gave man. Let us pray she sees the true teachings of Jesus Christ, our Lord and saviour. Amen

    • So LIBBY what did Ms Davis Agree to, do you have any idea what so ever? I kind of doubt it.

    • Once again I will ask this question, What is the name and number of the law passed by the House of
      Representatives and the Senate and signed by the President giving anyone the right to Marry someone of
      the same sex? I really would like to be able to read that LAW can you help there LIBERAL?

      • 14th amendment says you CAN’T STOP THEM from getting married.

        nothing new was created.

        Because the Red states pushed it to the Supreme Court, the justice’s hands were pretty much tied.
        Equal rights are equal rights.

        Being strict constitutionalists, you guys were doomed the second it was headed for the Supreme Court

        • I would really like for you to show me that copy of the Constitution and the
          Amendments that you are using. I have read mine and I do not see the world
          MARRIAGE in it anywhere. I also was under the impression that Justices of the
          Supreme Court are supposed to Interpret the LAW not make it up. I am still
          waiting on anyone to show me a copy of the LAW that has been passed by the
          CONGRESS and SIGNED by the PRESIDENT stating that this is the LAW OF THE
          LAND. STILL WAITING and WAITING and WAITING.

        • VirginiaConservative

          You people are amazing.. The court used the 14th to stamp out the 10th. At the same time, you people are actively working to abolish the 2nd Amendment.
          I have a perfectly legal concealed carry permit from The Commonwealth of Virginia.
          I am not permitted to carry my gun in Maryland, Delaware, New York, New Jersey and other states.
          Does the 14th Amendment overrule the laws of those states and will you people defend me if I am arrested for acting on my 2nd Amendment rights??

    • The Supreme court doesn’t make laws Congress does. Illegal aliens don’t make laws either.

    • Please give the CFR of the legislated law she broke. I can give examples of how SCOTUS broke the law (read the dissents in the opinion).

    • The SCOTUS just can’t make laws only interpret them. These renegades legislated from the bench just as the Constitution forbids. She is upholding her regional and state laws just as she was elected to do. Anyone that doesn’t so can pisz up a rope.

    • VirginiaConservative

      “She’s breaking the law of the United States of America”

      Which law is that?
      Can you name it?
      Can you provide the text of the law?
      She was elected to uphold the Constitution of the State of Kentucky. That has not changed.
      The supreme court does not make laws.. It is up to the Kentucky legislature to pass a law that will comply with the supreme court opinion.

  3. Btw- she looks really hot in that red sweater! She should wear something cooler!

  4. Kim Davis is awesome#

  5. #freeKimmyfromthesweater

  6. Bet my version of my Christian god is better than hers in every way!

    • There is only one version of a Christian God and obviously yours is not it. It says. “come follow me” not do as you do and I will accept it.

  7. Oh gee so this is how the Obama Administration and the ACLU and the LGBT community wants to observe what
    the Pope stated should be observed yesterday (RELIGIOUS FREEDOM)?

    • Where did he say it first? In Cuba? Rubbing noses with the Castro brothers?

      Get real. The Marxist-atheists seem to have won just now, but it is only in the institutional short term.

      • So now why don’t you come down off of your sugar high and explain what you really mean.

        • Sorry. Anyone who traffics with the Castro brothers has no business preaching ethics to anyone, anywhere. Period.

          Anyone who jets around the world, calling forth security clampdowns that discommode thousands of working people, should not lecture taxpayers on the sins of global warming. Period.

          Perhaps I can make myself clearer? Please let me know if I must go further to “explain what [I] really mean.”

    • These people could not care less about “religious freedom” or the “Constitution of the United States of America”.
      They are only interested in legal validation of their way of life.
      This will allow for certain financial benefits, in the way of taxes and insurance, but the main reason is that they can’t find anywhere, any justification for their decisions only condemnation by the laws of nature and God.
      They seek to be considered ” normal ” in their own eyes, absolving them of any misdirection or guilt.
      A “law” will acomplish this for them and allows them to poke a stick in the eye of normalcy.

      • Hey madashell I would just like to see this law that all of the liberals and LGBTers keep talking
        about. I have been unable to see anything that has been passed out of the congress stating
        that Same Sex Marriage is the Law of the Land.

        • The court did not create a law. They said for the purposes of marriage that existing laws could NOT discriminate against same sex couples. No new law just preventing existing laws from being discriminatory.

          • Not quite, the COURT STATED THAT STATES HAD TO GRANT THE RIGHT TO
            SAME SEX FOLKS TO GET MARRIED. This statement in itself dictates to the states
            that they have NO RIGHTS what so ever in this environment. So under this edict the
            FEDERAL JUDICIARY has usurped STATES RIGHTS and told all FIFTY STATES that
            the FEDERAL GOVERNMENT has the RIGHT to TELL THEM how to do what is rightfully
            a STATES RITE.

          • So once again please show me ONE SINGLE MARRIAGE CERTIFICATE that has been
            issued by the FEDERAL GOVERNMENT. I believe you will see that only States ISSUE
            MARRIAGE license thus it is a states right issue not a FEDERAL ISSUE.

      • You are claiming your beliefs are the norm. According to the constitution no religion can dictate the laws of the land. Would you be OK if a Muslim county clerk refused to issue you a marriage license because you were Christian? Or a Muslim Doctor who refuses to service you even though it is an emergency for the same reasons. No you cannot draw a line for Kim without opening a huge unworkable situation. She either needs to do her job or quit. What about the religious freedom of the people seeking a marriage license or their legal rights to obtain such a document. You only care about the bigot Kim and discard others beliefs. She needs to stop trying to shove her religious views down the throat of others.

        • She followed the state LAW…She did not shove anything down there throat. They shoved what they wanted down her throat. And muslims is not a religion, just communism is not a religion, they are an ideology. You better be the one to grow up.

        • VirginiaConservative

          ” According to the constitution no religion can dictate the laws of the land. According to the constitution no religion can dictate the laws of the land.”
          Really??? How does this translate into what you claim??:
          “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or
          prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of
          speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to
          assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.”

          The supremes opened a huge can of worms when they legislated from the bench. The only reasonable answer was to leave the issue up to the states.

          • No new laws were created. Parts of existing laws were declared unconstitutional. As for congress shall make etc. nothing changed. She is free to practice her religion all she wants. What she cannot do is not do the job she pledged to do. Would you like a pharmacist say you cannot have certain medications because they are against her religion? I.e. Birth control pills etc. would it be ok with you to be denied a marriage license because you are Christian and not Jewish? No, when working for the public you have to serve the entire public not just those your religion agrees with. Try not doing your job for religious reasons in the public sector and you would be fired pronto. So the Supremes did not legislate from the bench. They did what they are supposed to do and that is to make sure existing laws are constitutional.

          • VirginiaConservative

            1. You failed to respond to my question which was, where in the 1st amendment is this stated ” According to the constitution no religion can dictate the laws of the land. According to the constitution no religion can dictate the laws….” 1a. The supreme court does not have any power to make laws. The Congress and the States do. By this opinion, the supreme coourt has essentially voided the 10th and has created a mess. 1b ” What she cannot do is not do the job she pledged to do.” Sje was elected to follow the Constitution of the State of Kentucky. That has not changed.
            2.” Parts of the laws were declared unconstitutional” No new laws or regulations were put in place so, why was the woman jailed? For not following a law that does not exist? If part of the Constitution for Kentucky which stated that marriage is between one man and one woman was voided, there is no law re: marriage and she did the right thing by not issuing any marriage licenses.
            3. You people keep claiming she broke the law but as you stated, there is no law to be broken.
            4. Given your specious argument re: the 14th Amendment, what is going to stop polygamy or bigamy? After all “its about who you love”
            Don’t bother with 2 -4 , just answer #1.

            Subject: Re: Comment on The Punishment of Kim Davis Continues

          • She violated the law when she refused to issue marriage licenses to all who are legally able to obtain them. The Supreme Court in addition to saying that it is unconstitutional to deny same sex couples marriage also said it is against the law to interfere in that process. She was given ample time to change her position. She screams that she is being discriminated against when in reality it is the couples requesting a marriage license straight or same sex. She does not give a rats ass about the couples being denied licenses religious or legal rights. It is all about her and her religion. She refused to allow her clerks to issue one either in effect forcing her religion on others. With luck she will get to spend more time in the pokey. She loves the spotlight on her and her religion. No she is not a hero she is a bigoted law breaker.
            As for the 14th and polygamy that right now is a states issue. Nobody is permitted that. As for same sex marriages straights were permitted to be married and the court said states could not discriminate again same sex couples that want to be married. No different than interracial couples being allowed to marry.
            So yes the law she is violating is she is preventing couples from receiving their marriage licenses that they are legally entitled to.

          • VirginiaConservative

            “As for the 14th and polygamy that right now is a states issue. Nobody is permitted that.v”
            Bullshit!
            1. Why is it a states rights issue for polygamy and not homosexuality? 2. The supremes made up a “right” here none existed before.
            3. How can you possibly claim that the states have the ability to regulate any kind of marriage when that power was taken from them? Kentucky, to name one states, had a perfectly good Constitution until the supremes decided to void part of it. The marriage amendment was voted on and accepted by the people of the state. When the next group comes up and demands their “rights” what do you say to them?? Will you say, too bad, we don’t like polygamy, or we only care about homosexuals?? You idiots opened a giant can of worms and we have not heard the last of this issue.
            Subject: Re: Comment on The Punishment of Kim Davis Continues

          • Sorry but the court did not create any new laws. All it did was say since states allow straights to marry they have to allow same sex couples to also marry. With this everyone was then allowed to marry. Marriage was still limited to one person. This is no different then allowing couples of mixed race to marry.
            Now you think this is not the last gays will hear of this. Probably not but with the majority of people (60%) now in favor of same sex marriage it is obviously not going to be reversed.
            As for giving people the right to discriminate based on religious beliefs how would you feel if you went to the emergency room and the clerk told you sorry I am muslim and cannot allow you to be seen by the doctor or if your house is burning down and the fireman says sorry but we cannot put the fire out for people who are not Jewish. No, you are entitled to your beliefs but you are NOT entitled to push them on others. Others have beliefs as well and you would be stepping on them like Kim is with her stubbornness. She likes the attention but she is getting close to going back to jail and this time for a much longer time. She is the discriminator not the same sex couples she refuses to give a legal piece of paper that they are entitled to.

  8. Marriage in America has always been a civil contract. Churches, synagogues, temples etc. are free to do what they want to do with their members. That is why a serial adulteress like Ms. Davis can holler at queers all she wants.

    Ms. Davis is not free to take public, taxpayer money and then refuse to do her job.

    As my mother used to say, “We should have won that war, we should have won that war.” But let us be realistic. We lost the war that really counted. Let us make the best of it.

    • Tried and defeated only in the Court of Public Opinion by an over-reaching majority. Article 1 Section 8 shows the 18 items that are able to be Legislated by Federal Congress while the SCOTUS is not able to legislate anything (Article III/2), yet they did.

      • Lincoln repealed our Constitution by force of arms. Honest Abe has a marble monument to commemorate his feat.

        Earl Warren, who declared as law whatever laws he wanted to declare at his sole whim, was appointed by Eisenhower. Roe v. Wade was decided by SCOTUS wielding a Republican majority.

        To quote my mother: “We should have won that war, we should have won that war.” But we didn’t …

        • VirginiaConservative

          “Earl Warren, who declared as law whatever laws he wanted to declare at
          his sole whim, was appointed by Eisenhower. Roe v. Wade was decided by
          SCOTUS wielding a Republican majority.”
          So what, does that make any of it right?
          Would Eisenhower have appointed Warren if he had known Warren was going to be a corrupt judge?

  9. Yeh, poor Kim. She only makes 80 grand a year. Get rid of her azz.

  10. Se should resign and reevaluate her life.

  11. if you think she is correct, well , get ready to support the muslum’s honor killing, also a religious belief. Cannot have it both ways……

  12. I was told this is Land of the Free. Kim wanted to deny freedom to certain people. Kim would have denied the same benefits to Blacks, Latinos if it was in 50s. Kim is there paid by the government. It is her duty to do her job. She is free do so in her home, not at work.

  13. Since the battle is the Lord’s, let him fight it.

  14. May it should be changed to LGTBI, the I being for Intolerant or maybe even LGBTIH with H standing for hypocrites. What do they want , a public flogging, branding on the forehead, tar and feathering. How much hatred can this so-called loving group focus on one citizen. They are the same as the people they complain about.

    • You claim the LGBT community is intolerant you got to be kidding me. Look at all the harm Religious organizations have done to them. Firing from jobs, denial of housing, etc. No the intolerance is on the religious organizations and now that they are not getting everything there way they scream that they are being discriminated against. Get real.

      • No jokes here my friend. Just the wake up call and the removal of blinders from America. The true end game of the homo community has been brought to light by their very own actions. They truly are the only current group that keeps pushing and eroding our rights after they have received recognition. It’s very pathetic, childish, and bigoted.

        • What rights have you lost. None. Somebody else gay or straight getting married has nothing to do with you. You may not like it but that is not loss of a right. The only agenda is that they get equal rights which they are entitled to.

      • Can’t kid someone who has no sense of humor. Where do you get your information from? I don’t doubt that there are incidences where gays suffer the wrongs you list. prejudice and bigotry do exist, only a fool could deny that, however the things you mention are illegal and subject to punishments and litigation. They are not supported by law. Among my personal friends and acquaintances there have been a fair share of people who may be classified as gay and none of them ever suffered any of the things you mentioned. So it is by no means pandemic.

        • Sorry but the vast majority of states even today do not have laws to prevent gays from being evicted, fired, not hired etc. Including Texas where I live. And yes it happens. Look at the teacher in I believe it was Pennsylvania that after eight years was fired for being gay from a church school. The school knew the whole time she was married in 2007 but when a parent found out and complained they fired her even though she never discusses her personal life or advocates it. No religion is the biggest reason for prejudice and bigotry.

          • Evidence!!!!!!!!!!!!! Give the evidence

          • Google it. The woman was invited to visit with the Pope at the White House.

          • So!!!! What the hell has that got to do with evidence. clearly your an idiot

          • Whatever makes you happy. Texas, the state that calls Mexicans Greasers. That explains a lot. I guess I was just lucky where I grew up and it wasn’t in anythings goes but not in my neighborhood NYC., after 120 miles further North East.

          • I have lived in Texas for most of my adult life, sir.

            To date, I have NEVER heard a fellow Texan call ANY Mexican or Latino a “Greaser.”

          • I grew up in what is still the smallest state in the union. had to rub that in,spirit of competition and all that. I apologize to you , must have been the Californians I was thinking of or maybe it’s just one of those things that Hollywood came up with. I said what I said in response to RichWS and it was ill-advised. When I was at Ft Holabird I had a number of friends from Texas, to the point that I developed a Texas accent which drove my girl friend from NYC nuts. I have a tendency to absorb accents when exposed to them for a prolonged time. When my brother was in the AF he spend time at Lackland and later at Dallas/Ft Worth to the point that if he hadn’t been transferred to Edward AF Base, he would have liked to have settled in Texas.

          • No problem.

            Regarding your accent driving your girlfriend nuts — she has a serious problem. Many East and West Coasters ALL think that ANYONE with a Southern Drawl is automatically stupid, illiterate, uneducated, poor, you name it. I once had a friend who told me that my father was stupid because he had a BARELY recognizable Southern accent. My father was FAR from “stupid,” believe me.

            I spent 12-1/2 years in Southern California — from the time I was 12 until I was 25. During that time, I watched Governor Jerry “Moonbeam” Brown QUADRUPLE my State Income Taxes, and over-regulate the state to the max.

            Fortunately, I managed to ESCAPE before they ruined me!! ROFL

            I taught technical school at Lackland AFB for 5 years of my 7 years in the USAF.

            Texas is a great place to live — IF you can stay out of Houston and Austin — bastions of liberal Democrats in Texas!!!

            Tell your brother that I said “Thank You for Your Service!”

            Have a great day!

          • Right. And it was the Democratic “religion” that started the KKK.

      • Where’s your evidence of your statement.

    • Maybe if she obeyed the law, the punishment would stop

      • She IS obeying the Court of the United States ruling, sir. There is NOTHING in the decision stating that Ms. Davis is in any way, shape, or form to issue Marriage Licenses with HER signature.

        As a matter of fact, the State of Alabama just voted to take themselves out of the marriage industry altogether, as follows:

        “SB21 would have Alabama couples fill out a marriage contract rather than apply for a license. This contract would essentially inform the state that the couples wish to marry. Probate judges would see to it that the couples were of an appropriate age to marry and then file the paperwork away. Done and done. Same-sex couples and traditional couples would secure government permission without endangering the religious liberties of the state’s county clerks and judges.”
        See more at: http://unfilteredpatriot.com/alabama-takes-powerful-step-against-lgbt-agenda/#sthash.wPqAvWHz.dpuf

      • The law is one thing but millions of people is another. Now we’re bordering on bullying and lynch mob mentality. Apparently she didn’t break any law, because there isn’t one to break, and it’s not the law that is punishing her, it’s the LGBT community and that makes them look like the bad guys. She could be fired for refusing to do her job. She didn’t start a campaign or an organized movement, the media seems to feed on doing that sort of thing. It sells newspapers.The worst thing that could happen is that she becomes a martyr for bigot fringe and it degenerates into a us versus them situation.

        • Davard do you have any clue what went on? The LAW is, when a Federal Judge directs you to do your job as a public employee, and you refuse to obey the Judge’s directive, you are held in civil contempt. She wasn’t jailed for braking the law and the LGBT community isn’t punishing her. The reason she remains in the spot light is she continues to appeal to the Courts and continues to lose. And rather than STFU and do her job she instead altered the marriage forms to the point where they may no longer be valid, IN VIOLATION OF a FEDERAL COURT RULE If she wants to live in peace she should either obey the law or quit he job as a public servant

    • You are correct sir. Thank you.

    • Why can’t the gays show this woman some respect and just go to another county for there marriage license, is that so hard? Or if they find a baker that has reasonable objections to baking a wedding cake for a gay wedding just go to another baker maybe one run by gays, is that so hard? If you find a photographer that is uncomfortable taking pictures at a gay wedding, why not just find another photographer, is that so hard?

  15. Even though I am not for homosexual marriage and agree with her position on this subject, she should quit her job. She was hired to follow the law of the land not make personal decisions. I and my wife were both government employees and neither of us would have thwarted the law of our agencies but we would had quit if it infringed upon our beliefs.
    Now that she and her agency are usurping the law to fit her agenda, she should be fired and her agency should be, at least, admonished, maybe something a bit stronger to get them to follow the law.

    • Perhaps she has read our Constitution and can see it is not anything that the Legislative Federal Gov’t is able to Legislate, and to prevent later trouble, she wishes to show why her state’s law is being violated. As a clerk for the State of Kentucky, she was hired to ensure compliance with Kentucky and Federal Legislation under the Supreme Law of the Land, the Constitution. She has, and the “laws” created by SCOTUS shouldn’t be applicable. Now that she and her agency are properly not relinquishing (abrogating) their responsibilities and States’ rights, they should be praised and applauded.

    • A voice of reason!

  16. the gays are mentally ill and as such flip out and attack others that do not agree with them.Is it normal to think you are a different sex other than what you were born?NO! There was a time we did believe gays were mentally ill and i say they were not wrong.All the supreme court did was give legal standing to mental illness.No matter what gays say Kim has the freedom to practice religion as she see’s fit and that is what this country was founded on.You can say what ever you want but you cannot change our history as a country.Only liberals can be such screw ups and try to get it all wrong in their ideal utopia that does not exist anywhere on this planet.wait until all the muslims you bring here kill all of you and take over.Their women are slaves and they kill gays as their history has shown for over a thousand years.Change that liberals as i dare you to.

  17. Elsie, Al & PM,
    You guys are kidding, right? There is no way that anyone with any knowledge at all of our Constitution cannot but mourn over this.
    As has been stated over & over – Davis is upholding the laws that she was elected to. Since then, there has been NO new laws written. The SCOTUS “found” gay marriage as a “right” just as they found abortion, etc. BUT, SCOTUS cannot make law, period. Only the congresses of either the US or individual state can write law.
    So, KY has no new law, the US has no new law. It’s all “legislating from the bench” which is NOT constitutional. That’s why we supposedly have separation of powers. This is why POTUS’s executive orders are so disturbing.
    This is exactly why, no matter how hard it is, who it “hurts” that we need to demand of our Fed. Gov, to uphold the Constitution & that there are clear roles for each branch.
    Remember, each & every breach erodes the constitution & our great country more & more.

    • Scotus did not make any new laws. What they did was say as regards marriage you cannot discriminate against same sex couples per the equality clause of the 14th amendment. States could ban marriage entirely if they do not want to include same sex couples. Oh, per the constitution it is legal for the courts to rule as they have.

      • Actually it is not. 33 states have voted against homo marriage and only because of the special interest groups has the SCOTUS decided to change the meaning of marriage and reinterpret the Constitution to fit their agenda. Do not be fooled into believing they are doing what is the will of people but are instead following a plan set in motion by the liberal/homo agenda.

        • Over sixty percent of the US population now supports same sex marriage. You lost get over it.

          • “A lie doesn’t become truth, wrong doesn’t become right, and evil doesn’t become good just because it’s accepted by a majority.” You seem to have problems “getting over it” when it comes to morality, according to God’s law AGAINST homosexuality.

          • The GREAT news is this is a Country of Laws, just not your god’s laws

          • As the Declaration Of Independence says, we hold these truths to be self evident that all men are created equal, and are endowed by the “Creator”, they weren’t talking about the president. So yes you have God given rights, not man given rights.

          • My mother and father were my ‘Creators’ and I will then live by all the rights they ‘gave’ me.

          • You have both.
            Wake up and smell the coffee.

          • That’s if you believe your Creator was god

          • This is a country of FREEDOM as well —

            Freedom of speech,

            Freedom of expression,

            Freedom of religion,

            Freedom of the so-called press,

            Freedom to bear arms, etc.

            And “God’s law” consists of one thing and one thing only when it comes to “a Country of Laws.”

            That one thing is that we are to “give that which belongs to Caesar TO Caesar, and to give that which belongs to God, TO God.”

            Between that and FREE WILL, it pretty much says it all.

            However, as a so-called “lawyer,” even YOU should be smart enough to know that EVERY SINGLE PERSON in this country is ENTITLED to ACCOMMODATION for whatever reason they need such an accommodation under the CONSTITUTION OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA!!

            That includes:

            Religious accommodation, (i.e., the wearing of a yarmulke, a turban, a cross, a crescent, a Star of David or any other religious symbol, time to pray, time to worship, etc.)

            Disability accommodation, i.e., a comfortable chair, being able to sit in order to perform a job that requires standing, wheelchair access, doctor appointments without retaliation, etc.

            Gender accommodation, i.e., providing a female restroom and shower facilities at an all-male school, etc.

            There are many, many other types of “reasonable accommodation,” as I am sure you are aware.

          • Your gender comment is way off base now, they have both for restrooms all over the states including state/federal/schools/department stores ETC. You can’t yell fire in a crowed theater. Get it dumbass

          • You, sir, are the d***a**.

            I was referring to military schools and universities that, until a few years ago, were ALL MALE. If you will recall, these schools had no reason to provide male/female facilities.

          • Thanks for dumbass name calling , I am not a mind reader you did not say military schools. So who’s the dumb ass now.

          • Sorry, but that moniker still belongs to you. I figured you actually had some brain power and could figure out what schools I was talking about for yourself.

          • My school is still all-male. It makes sense. Women, blooming into youth, are a distraction to the normal male, especially to a normal adolescent.

            How hard is this to understand? [Okay, a bad pun.]

          • ‘a distraction to the normal male’. It’s always funny when folks reference a man’s sex drive as ‘uncontrollable ‘. It’s like men can fight in combat, run companies, lead countries but they completely lose their focus if a girl/woman is present. That is pathetic. It’s like in the middle of an intense fire fight, just when the moment comes when……….SQUIRREL!

          • Surprise! The human being is an animal, with typically animal instincts. These need controlling. We may aspire to higher things, but we don’t get into the Elysian Fields, except through God’s Grace.

            “Male and female created He them,” Gen. I:27, thus unleashing chaos and sin upon the world. If you have a spare moment, read Milton. “Paradise Lost” was required reading at my [all-male] high school. It does not get much better than Milton.

          • Are you implying male sex drives can not be controlled except by God’s grace? I have no idea what Elysian fields are so I’m not sure I’m understanding your response correctly.

          • Beats me. It’s about as stupid as allowing women into combat.

            Which, as I am sure you know, was NEVER about gender bias. It was to keep women from being tortured, raped, and murdered by their captors.

          • You make a good, if sensitive, point. Rape has always been an instrument of war.

          • Crazy Whore, all of those things can happen to men as well

          • I never said they didn’t. However, the torture visited upon women is FAR WORSE!!
            And, stop calling me “Crazy Whore” or I will contact my attorney and sue for libel.

          • Far worse? What a crock Call your “attorney” and sue me You loon

          • Sue for Libel..HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

          • You have previously stated that you could provide “absolute proof” that I am the vile name you are calling me.

            All I need is your IP address, which is very easy to obtain.

          • I never said anything of the sort, but thanks for trying There is much more to a defamation claim than name calling on the internet you moron

          • Now we need a third bathroom for queers. or 4? one for queers and another for lesbians.
            When I come back next time, i want to be a lesbian, because I like women.
            I have been in a woman’s body, however, I always pulled “sparky” out after climax.
            and I was a male inside a woman’s body, until my mother gave birth.

          • Your a very kind and logical soul, Thank you for your comment. and take care you.

          • Ms Davies is being accommodated. She can do her job, or she can choose not to.

            If she isn’t going to perform her job, she can be relieved of it See how accommodating we can be

          • And show us how this marriage thing is following “laws” when a baker or a florist or someone who owns a small chapel are forced into “doing the bidding” of the homosexual 3% when they are fully capable of going down the street to a different place of business that’s ok with this? NO ONE has been denied a cake or denied flowers, but these businesses were being commanded to participate in a ceremony that they firmly do not believe in.
            Yet, when a muslim bookstore refuses to serve a christian, or a homo baker refuses to bake a cake for a traditional marriage meeting, there’s nothing done!
            Mr. King, you are sorta right – our country was/is based on Lex Rex, but we are far from that concept now & steamrolling faster away each week.

          • If your business is open to the public, your serve all the public.

            If you do not want a public business, then open a private club.

          • What you are pontificating is accurate as far as it goes. I am not going to deny my teaching services (tutoring or otherwise) to any student coming into my place of business, BUT if I am requested to provide teaching services of something that I don’t believe to a group that does believe that “whatever” then it has become more than me providing for a customer. Example (ridiculous, but trying to stay away from a controversial subject): I teach chemistry & physics. I have a student’s parent (customer) request that I come to their “meeting” and help them “celebrate” by teaching them about Aristotelian theories of matter. To me, this is wrong, foolishness and against what I believe, yet, taking what’s happening in several places around our country, this is being foisted upon many small businesses. This is extremely irritating & WRONG because in every case that I’m aware of, this specific business was targeted, when there were options available just down the street. Hence, these extremists are forcing their beliefs & desires on all of us.

          • You are not making any sense. If a specific business has a history of discrimination, they should be targeted.

          • The pizza shop 80 miles north of me was sued for “discrimination” because a gay couple (I don’t know if male or female, that’s not the point) because they were intentionally sought out by an activist who was seeking to entrap this young couple. The owners thought that they were being interviewed for the “business section” of a paper and were asked if they would “cater a gay wedding”. As the couple are known to be conservative Christians, they answered that their faith/beliefs would not allow them to partake in the celebration of a gay couple.
            They were NOT asked if they allowed gays into their restaurant (they do because they don’t ask!) and they were NOT asked if they would hire a gay (again, why would they even ask?).
            By the way? They don’t even CATER! Yet, they were sued.
            It’s been the same with the baker & florist. It’s the same even with Davis, as there are other County Courthouses that any of these couples could have gone to and they could have just left Davis alone with her beliefs intact and their “marriage” intact.
            These extremists aren’t after equality, they’re after domination & control.
            Upon my word, watch & see. I’ve been watching this for over 4 decades…

          • If a business has a history of discrimination, they should be targeted.

            One should not be allowed to break the law indefinitely.

          • I have lost the thread. Just to say, Bruce Bagemihl’s “Biological Exuberance and Natural Diversity” is that weird big book that tracks down same-sex practices in a lot of difference species and ties it into evolutionary theory. A highly amusing read. Why one should devote so much time and effort into the topic was beyond me at the time, but here I am unable to sleep, racked with pain and I now find it amusing.

          • Victoria D Matlock

            If you serve Good and Serves an Own a Store Then you Need to serve Not Just who you want But every One Money Money and I have Owned My Businesses for a Long Time I have 4 A Writing Serves A Ministry And Buying Corp On line and A Cleaning Corp where I put Disabled To Work Cleaning Peoples Home For a Fate Wage With out Loosing There Disability In Any ways Fair wage For A Good Days Pay so do you Own Your Own Corp ?

          • You AK are about as STUPID as a BRICK!! I just pray that the minds you are suppose to be “teaching” are at least smart enough to repel your philosophy/stupidity!!!

          • Discrimination is illegal.
            That is law.

            Those that break the law should experience the consequences of doing so.

            Is that simple enough for you to understand?

          • Are you absolutely sure that’s GREAT news?? I agree that there are a lot of laws that are acceptable here in America, that I personally feel are justified and for our own good, but there are a lot of “laws” that have been put into effect recently that are NOT good. Search your heart, you’ll figure it out. All people have the ability to distinguish between good and bad…. some people just choose bad because it’s more to their liking.

          • Hate to tell you but the Lord nor Christ ever said a bad word as regards homosexuality. I imagine you wrote this while wearing your clothing made out of two different fabrics while enjoying your shrimp cocktail. There are a number of major Christian churches that disagree with you and support gays and same sex marriage including Episcopalian, Evangelical Lutheran, American Presbyterian etc. So not even the Christian religions agree on weather homosexuality is a sin or not. So quit trying to act like you are talking for Christianity when in effect you are talking for one of the Christian churches that happens to feel it is a sin. While 33 states did vote against same sex marriage most were years ago and today the polls all show an average of over 60 percent are in favor for it. Worry about your own sins and not others.

          • It makes not difference what some churches say. Homosexuality is unnatural and disgusting. Marriage is designed for procreation and same sex people can not make a baby. If you are in a union with a same sex partner I don’t care but don’t call it a marriage, that’s insulting to everyone.

          • I have been in a heterosexual marriage for 18 years I love my wife very much. Our marriage is wonderful And 2 guys getting married or 2 women getting married is not going to change that, nor does it insult me in any way. They are free to do as they please, it has no effect on me whatsoever. Whats insulting is when small minded people like yourself try to push your so called values on others

          • You said… ” There are a number of major Christian churches ” … I got some bad news for you Bubba…
            Those “churches” are christian In Name Only.

            sin is sin… scripture has plenty to say about the subject…

          • You are exactly correct, Andrew. There are groups that wish that was no GOD/JESUS, so there would be no sin.

          • That is your interpretation of the scripture. Written by man and interpreted by man. Unless Christ or the Lord said it for me it is just basic hear say. Who decided which scrolls to decode and put in the bible (man) by whose authority (dammed if we know). So you believe what you want as I am sure it is very selective. Bet you wear polyester cotton clothing, eat shellfish and pork. Do not stone your kids for talking back. Did not stone your wife (if you were able to find one to put up with your bigotries) for not being a virgin on her wedding night which in todays times that includes probably 95% or better. The list goes on and on yet you choose a few versus in the bible condemning gays and conveniently ignore many others. So since you are following the bible why not go get your buddy Kim Davis, make her your slave which is OK in the bible and it is OK to beat her if she does not do as requested. So you believe your fairy tales and I will believe mine.

          • You read an AWFUL lot into my simple comment about bogus “christians” up a ways… ^^^ making comments on things I didn’t even say.

          • Having been baptized in three different churches, I have always wanted to know why the Baptists hid their many sex abusers away. I can understand the Catholics: the Romans are sitting on pots of money. But Baptists? They are as broke as organ-grinders. [yes, pun]

            And, yes, Scripture does have “plenty to say about the subject.”

          • Having been baptized in three different churches? Are you bragging or are you NOT sure you are saved? You do realize that baptism doesn’t secure your salvation. You can be baptized 200 times, if you don’t accept Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior, a little dunking ain’t gonna help you atoll!

          • We have had this discussion several times in my Bible study group. Baptism is the outward and visible sign of one’s identity within a community of faith. It does not guarantee salvation. What does guarantee salvation? That is where Luther is so profound. And Calvin.

            My grandmothers had a sort of duel as to who could save me most convincingly, the Presbyterian or the Catholic. Then came my Baptist buddy to the rescue. So I have been both sprinkled and dunked.

            Preachers and priests usually argue in favor of the institutional church. I remain, like you, skeptical.

            BTW, “atoll” is where I want to be just now, basking in the South Pacific. Spell-check is treacherous.

          • This year’s sin will be next year’s ancient history. Always has been with Christianity, always will be.

          • You had better read the bible then, Leviticus 20:12, 20:13, 20:14, John, etc. It’s perfectly clear to its meaning. As we are all born of sin, Jesus died for us on the cross, so we all can have salvation through the Lord. God doesnt mess with free will, as we will all be judged for our sins when we die. If a person is gay so be it, whatever floats their boat, but there should be equal treatment for religious people too, and not
            this mafia style treatment saying man makes all
            the rules.

          • I have read it. It is filled with things that were the norms of there times not God’s word. God made it pretty clear his views in the ten commandments. Again you probably wear clothing made of two different fabrics, eat shellfish, eat pork, do not stone your children for being disrespectful, did not stone your wife for not being a virgin on her wedding day, etc. etc. It goes on and on. Also why do you not have a slave since Leviticus says you can have one. Again, 95% of what is in Leviticus is norms of times and not Gods will.

          • We have voices and express them in this venue.

            Homosexuality tendency is not a sin, acting on this tendency IS a sin. The sexual organs were created by God for procreation and the joy of a married ….man and woman….
            couple. Marriage had a definition already……..a union of a same-sex couple needs a new name….can’t use marriage as it is already defined.

            How many people on the US claim to be LGBT? 1.6 % at the most….no, not 20 %.

            We Christians reference The Holy Scriptures and the traditions since the coming of Jesus Christ, our leader. Marriage works in raising children who are happy and contribution to society. Same-sex not so well.

          • the bible called it an abomination….

          • The Quran as well is against it and it is an abomination! I am not Muslim but I have a friend who is. So, you have the Jews, Christians, and the Muslim all against this as well!

          • You are wrong; it is plain to anyone seeking truth that Jesus did speak on homosexuality. What do you think he was referring to when he said “man should not lay with man or woman with woman.” Yes I am paraphrasing, but check the Bible and let me know if I am wrong. God bless.

          • Most Bibles have an index in the rear. Look at your for the wordhomosexuals. The verses concerning what God said in regard to this, are multiple. Basically, for one man t o lie with another is a perversion in MY sight!
            Sorry I can’t quote the verses, but I have read them.

          • Well aware about that but again the Lord nor Jesus ever said a bad word about homosexuality. Nada… Yes there are phrases in the bible but there are a lot of phrases that people ignore such as stone your children if they disrespect you. It is an abomination to wear clothing made of multiple fabrics and an abomination if you eat shellfish or pork. Same book. So no I do not believe everything in the bible. I do however believe in what the Lord told me which can be summed up with the Ten Commandments and Jesus’ eleventh about love.

          • Now… now… where did I read that word ‘Abomination’.
            Got it from the Bible, somewhere…

          • Look under your shrimp cocktail…

          • But your very own religion has changed it’s view of right and wrong repeatedly. Slavery was right. Then slavery was wrong. Interracial marriages were wrong. Then they were right. Women are inferior and subservient to men, now some Christians say that is wrong. Integration was against God, now it is right.
            Christians can not be trusted with the rules of morality because they don’t know what is right or wrong from one sermon to the next.

          • It is NOT Christianity that has changed! It is MAN that has changed it!! GOD DOES NOT CHANGE!! The world (flesh) changes things to fit its needs. This is not Christianity!

          • Ok, then where does the Christian God stand on the issues I mentioned?

          • Slavery was never “right” with GOD. His own chosen people were slaves to the Egyptians until Moses led the Hebrews to the promised land. He didn’t make them slaves but he allowed them their own free will and the Hebrews allowed themselves to become slaves. God only mentioned the Isrealites (his chosen people) to marry their own kind to preserve them as a pure race. As for women, they are not inferior to men but, men are suppose to be the “HEAD” of the household and woman is suppose to serve man, just as man is suppose to take care of the woman. It is suppose to be 100% given to 100% given back. Neither sex was to be superior to the other. Intergration was prominent in biblical times, that is why the apostles spoke in tongue to the masses, there were people from all different dilects present and the Holy Spirit filled the apostles and allowed ALL the different languages to be heard at one time so that ALL could hear the message of Jesus Christ. Through the ages, man made his own laws and THAT is what you are talking about. I didn’t make this up, the bible says this and if it is written in the bible, I BELIEVE IT!

          • You Christians don’t know your asses from your elbows. All that religion has turned your brains to mush. This is what happens when you believe in invisible beings & fairy tales.

          • King James Version
            Matthew 13:19-23
            19:When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side.
            20: But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;
            21:Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.
            22:He also that receiveth seed among the thorns is he that hearth the word: and care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful.
            23: But he that receiveth seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.
            Christ said it, I believe it , and you just PROVED it!!

          • Excellent comment!!

          • There is no such law.

          • Morality is a cultural set of rules. Morality is not law.

            No one is forcing you to marry someone of the same sex.

            Get over it. You cannot force your beliefs on other people.

            Better yet, mind your own business.

          • But you are intent on forcing yours on others and refer to them as haters because they disagree with you.

          • That is an empty argument. Equality is the law. Learn to live within the law.

          • You just said it…. You cannot force your beliefs on other people. So if I refuse to serve you because my BELIEF is different than yours, how is it OK for you to sue me if I don’t cater to your belief? If I can be sued because I don’t cater to your belief, then you ARE forcing your belief on me!!

          • Beliefs are morality, or visa versa.

            Morality is not law.

            Law supersedes belief.

            Enforcing belief upon others, when serving the public, is discrimination.

            Discrimination is illegal.

            If you discriminate, you can be sued.

          • The God of your religion. You may not force others to abide by the laws of your religion.

            If you do not believe in same-sex marriage, don’t marry someone of your sex.

            Else mind your own business.

          • We get our laws from The Constitution, not that phony book you call the word of god. IMO, the bible has become extinct, just like the dinosaurs. Only difference- It’s been proven by Science that dinosaurs actually did exist millions of years ago. No proof whatsoever, that the bible is factual. It is a fictional book, full of fairy tales & mythology. You lose. Get over it.

          • I feel very sorry for you. Really, I do. Because the day will come when all the TRUTH will be revealed, you find out how WRONG you are, but it will be too late for you to even apologize for your disbelief. You can cry out things like, “I’m sooo sorry!!! I was misled!” Nope…. it won’t do you any good at all. Then…. along comes eternity spent in hell. I’m not just talking about a few dozen years in prison… I’m talking about ETERNITY in FIRE.

          • Just the same old bullshit. Anytime you Christians are challenged by someone about your religion, all you can do is use threats against them. Well, it’s getting old & it doesn’t work anymore. If you want to believe in an invisible sky daddy, knock yourself out. As for me, I don’t believe in hell, therefore, your threats are meaningless . Can you tell me where this place is you call hell ? How can you prove that hell really exist ? Truth is you can’t. I rest my case.

          • Very well then. Believe what you want to believe. Or not, whatever your case may be… and I won’t argue any more with you because you’re simply not worth the time and aggravation. I just hope on YOUR day, when it comes, that you depart from your earthly body, you will be shown mercy simply because it really isn’t your fault that you’re ignorant of truth.

          • You believe anything that the liberal media and press reports do you. That so call poll might inaccurate. Wake up and face reality you being lied to all the time our media.

          • People didnt have a problem with it per say until their true agenda came out. Now polls are showing people are turning their backs on the lgbt community. Whats good for the goose is good for the gander so to speak.

          • Bullshit! Fag!

          • Hate to tell you I am a happily married (to a woman) for 48 years. I just am not a bigot and support my gay friends. You can call me all the names you want. If I were gay I would be ashamed to admit it. So grow up and keep your bigotry to yourself.

          • So if you were gay you would be ashamed to admit it. So you know its wrong. Closet homophobe much.

          • No the word NOT got dropped. Definitely not a closet anything. But happy not to be a bigot like you. You will have to explain that to the Lord when your time comes and I know he is not going to be too happy with your ass.

          • No its there in your post, you are a bigot. Cant take back what you said, you’d be ashamed of it, and thats ok, its your life. And I never said anything other than the bible states its wrong, so dont try twisting my words. By the way smart guy my brother is gay, and whether I approve of his lifestyle or not, I still love him and will stand by him. Funny thing is he’s not all radicalized like you bandwagon jumpers.

          • Then why not stand for the couples who want to get married in Kim Davis’ county.

          • ” Funny thing is he’s not all radicalized like you bandwagon jumpers.”

            actually silly conservative, it’s only the rabid right that are on any kind of bandwagon.

          • Is that so, I’m not a conservative. But does it matter to the looney left, sure it does, you pick at every little thing like its your last cause on earth. I dont have time to sweat the so called gay thing, as dont most people, there are more important things in life worth worrying about. But your name says it all, you do need a reality check, and a life.

          • You can support your homosexual friends, but discuss with them their sin and remember you must continually ask for forgiveness; because we all sin. However, repent means to turn from the sin, so two men or two women cannot marry because they are turn from their sin.

          • I do not believe true love is sin, straight or gay.

          • i ll say what i please, you might want to read the part of the bible that speaks of marriage between a man and a woman and how homo is an abomination to the lord!

          • You know, I am SO SICK AND TIRED of hearing, “You lost. Get over it.” that it makes me want to puke. If ANY Republican or Independent voter said that, you would all be shouting to the heavens about “all those mean conservatives!”

            I could care less that gay people want to get married. We have not had to vote on that in my state.

            What I object to is the FACT that GAY ACTIVISTS are NOTHING but ANARCHISTS, and that is a very small minority of the number of LGBT people in this country, who are themselves a small minority of the entire US population.

            What I object to is the FACT that GAY ACTIVISTS do NOT want to grant ANYONE a small accommodation, and that is EXACTLY what Kim Davis IS asking for, under the First Amendment to the Constitution.

            What I object to is the FACT that it isn’t enough for them to now have the right to get married. Now, it seems they want to punish everyone who does not ascribe to their agenda.

            And THAT, sir, is ANARCHY at its finest.

            If you want to get married, then GET MARRIED, for God’s sake.

            But DO NOT try to FORCE everyone to either agree or go along with your agenda!

          • First of all, all the gay people wanted was to get married but it seems you need a marriage license which Kim has refused to allow them to get even though they are legally able to have it. They are not asking for anything special just the same rights as everyone else. It is Kim Davis who is the ACTIVIST for her religious beliefs who does not give a crap about others religious or legal rights. What accommodation are you alluding to? To drive 30 miles to another county clerks office which might do the same as Kim. No they pay taxes in that county and she has to do her job or quit or go to jail. Her call.

          • No, sir, that is NOT the accommodation I am referring to.

            She is ENTITLED to a small accommodation, and she IS still issuing marriage licenses, sir, in accordance with the Court of the United States decision — just not with her personal signature.

            The licenses she is now issuing ARE 100% LEGAL, they DO accommodate not just GAY COUPLES but ALL COUPLES who wish to marry, so EVERYONE is being treated EQUALLY.

            That is apparently not enough for the Gay Activists and the ACLU. They want her very job — a job she has been doing successfully for over 26 years.

          • she is entitled to do her job, no more no less

          • Crazy Whore,Nobody is asking Kim Davies to agree with the LGBT agenda. Nobody is asking Kim Davis to marry a woman. They are asking Kim Davis to do her job.

            Next time your boss asks you to do your job, throw your arms up and run out the door screaming Anarchy, and see how far that gets you

          • First of all, I am a disabled veteran.

            Kim Davis DID, indeed, receive her accommodation, and has altered the marriage licenses — which is ENTIRELY LEGAL — to state that the marriage license is issued in accordance with the ruling of the Court of the United States.

            That does not satisfy the Gay Activists. They will not stop until they either drive her out of a job she has held and done successfully for over 26 years.

            They will not stop until HER NAME — which she is NOT required to put on the new marriage licenses — is on a marriage license.

            Nobody is being discriminated against. This license is being LEGALLY issued to ALL couples – gay or straight.

            And, by the way, the State of Alabama has now stopped issuing marriage licenses to ANYONE. Read the story.

          • hope all these revenge seeking Gays catch AIDs

          • Strange… I had heard just opposite. 60% had supported traditional marriage. Where do these numbers come from??

          • Virtually every study done in the last two years has had support for same sex marriage above 50 percent. That includes all the major pollsters. Gallup etc. Most recently after the SCOTUS ruling it had reached as high as sixty percent. A few years ago I agree the numbers were below fifty. Now that more and more people are coming out and people are realizing that they know and care about gay people attitudes have changed. Not in the above 55 crowd but in the younger crowd who do not see a problem with it.

          • That is because Christianity has been removed from school, no more teaching of right from wrong and all the liberal indoctrination being taught in our public schools! Now “ANYTHING GOES” is the normal and that is usually anything against Christian values! We are quickly approaching the end times. The bible tells us that the end times are near when we see things like morality going by the wayside. When Good will be bad and Bad will be good. Satan knows he only has so much time left to corrupt this world that he is now working overtime!! If even satan knows about God, and HE (GOD) causes the demons to tremble, I can’t understand why EVERYONE doesn’t know/believe in GOD??!! But one day, every knee will bow and every mouth confess that Jesus Christ is Lord!!

          • I do not disagree with you that more teaching of right and wrong needs to be taught in our schools. But I disagree that it is liberal indoctrination. I assume you think gay rights are immoral. While the left may be more for gay rights, abortions etc. the right is also very unchristian in that they are willing to harm the poor and people in need in order to take care of their rich friends. They would defund Social Security, Medicare, cut back on school financing etc. So you cannot just blame the left. Also, the majority in the USA especially the youth disagree with you and at least five major Christian churches also disagree with you. I agree I do not understand why everyone does not believe in God.

          • The majority of the USA especially the youth disagree with me proves my point in the above post! As for as the five major Christian churches, well, I got news for you, they aren’t Christian if they are not preaching/teaching God’s word and his word tells us that homosexuality is an abomination! God’s word is the same today as it was written over 2000 years ago and DID NOT CHANGE!! If you would read the bible, it tells us in the end times that preachers/ministers/priests will preach to itchy ears, in other words preach to them only what the people want to hear and not the truth!! If a church is truly teaching/preaching Christianity, then they are teaching/preaching the word of GOD, with nothing added or taken away

          • I hate to tell you Karen but I have read the bible and a lot of the stuff in there is the norm of the times not the word of God. I guarantee you that you eat shellfish and pork. Wear clothing made out of more than one fabric. I am also sure you would not stone your kids for be disrespectful to you. The list goes on and on. There are about forty or fifty abominations in the bible. Yet you pick and choose which ones to believe and follow and which ones you can discard. Sorry you do not have that right. Again, God and Jesus never ever said a single thing against homosexuality. Yes there are passages in the bible. The bible which was put together by man of scrolls interpreted by man (of which there are different versions) etc.

            Now as for different churches doing things different as regards gays it is because their interpretation is different than the bible you use. There are as many Christian denominations of Christianity that believe that God created homosexuals and that they are part of his divine plan then there are Christian denominations that are opposed to homosexuals.

            The following is a list of things the Bible considers an abomination and I bet you do not follow all of them:

            Unclean things (Lev. 7:21)

            Customs of pagans (Lev. 18:30)

            Idols (2 Chr. 15:8; 1 Pet. 4:3)

            Sins of men (Ps. 14:1; 53:1)

            Cheating (Mic. 6:10)

            Lost souls (Rev. 21:8)

            A froward man (perverse; one who turns aside (Pro. 3:32; 11:20)

            A proud look (Pro. 6:16-17)

            A lying tongue (Pro. 6:17; 12:22)

            Hands that shed innocent blood ((Pro. 6:17)

            A wicked scheming heart (Pro. 6:18)

            Feet that are quick to sin (Pro. 6:18)

            A false witness that speaks lies (Pro. 6:19)

            A sower of discord (Pro. 6:19)

            Wickedness (Pro. 8:7)

            A false balance or scale (Pro. 11:1)

            Sacrifices of the wicked (Pro. 15:8; 21:27)

            The way of the wicked (Pro. 15:9)

            The thoughts of the wicked (Pro. 15:26)

            The proud of heart (Pro. 16:5)

            Justifying the wicked (Pro. 17:15)

            Condemning the just (Pro. 17:15)

            Divers, dishonest weights (Pro. 20:10, 23)

            Divers, dishonest measures (Pro. 20:10)

            Refusing to hear the law (Pro. 28:9)

            Prayers of the rebel (Pro. 28:9)

            Eating flesh of peace offerings on the 3rd day (Lev. 7:18)

            Some same sex acts (Lev. 18:22; 20:13; Dt. 23:18)

            Taking ornaments from idols when being destroyed (Dt. 7:25-26)

            Any Idolatrous practices (Dt. 12:31; 13:14; 17:4; 18:9; 20:18; 29:17)

            Offering an imperfect animal to God as a sacrifice (Dt. 17:1)

            Any traffic with demons (Dt. 18:7-12)

            Wearing clothes of the opposite sex (Dt. 22:5)

            Bringing the hire of a harlot or sodomite into God’s house (Dt. 23:18)

            Re-marriage of former companions (Dt. 24:1-4)

            Cheating others (Dt. 25:13-16)

            Making images/idols (Dt. 27:15)

            Idols of Ammon (1 Ki. 11:5)

            Idols of Moab (1 Ki. 11:7; 2 Ki. 11:13)

            Idols of Zidon (2 Ki. 23:13)

            Incense offered by hypocrites (Isa. 1:13)

            Eating unclean things (Isa. 66:17)

            Offering human sacrifices (Jer. 32:35)

            Robbery (Ezek. 18: 6-13)

            Murder (Ezek. 18: 6-13)

            Adultery (Ezek. 18: 6-13)

            Oppression of others, particularly the poor or vulnerable (Ezek. 18: 6-13)

            Violence (Ezek. 18: 6-13)

            Breaking vows (Ezek. 18: 6-13)

            Lending with interest to a brother (Ezek. 18: 6-13)

            Lying with a menstruous woman (Ezek. 18: 6-13)

            Hardness of heart (Ezek. 18: 6-13)

            Injustice (Ezek. 18: 6-13)

            Worship of anti-Christ (Dan. 11:31; 12:11; Mt. 24:15; 2 Th. 2:4; Rev. 13)

            Incest (Lev. 19: 6-30)

            Things highly esteemed by man (Lk. 16:15)

            Many other sins of the nations (Lev. 18: 26-29; Dt. 18: 9-12; 20:18; 29:17; 1 Ki. 14:24; 21:2, 11; 23:24; 2 Chr. 28:3; 33:2; 34:33; 36:14; Ezek. 7: 3-20; 8: 6-17; 16: 2-58; 20: 4-30; Rev. 17: 4-5)

          • What 60 percent? I was never asked to “VOTE” on this, neither was my husband nor my three children nor their spouses! Where do you get the 60 % of the us population numbers from? do the ask 100 people and average it out for all of us? If you go to San Diego, New Orleans. San Francisco, etc. and ask the 100 people I’m sure you would get at least 60 %, but ask in the Bible Belt states and I’m Sure the % would be very much lower. So quit patting yourself on the back… the real % is probably 30 % IF that high, and that is only because being LGBT is the “NEW FAD”!

        • Clearly you have NO IDEA what you are talking about, and apparently have no clue when it comes to constitutional jurisprudence

          • religious freedom should trump fa–ot marriage.

          • You are free not to marry someone of your own sex. However, you cannot force your religion on other people.

          • Then why are they allowed to force THEIR “religion” on me?

          • No one is forcing any religion upon you. No one forced any religion on the Clerk.

          • Marriage is a civil contract. Churches and mosques are free to shun gays, adulterers/divorcees, usurers, publicans etc. But a clerk has to perform her duty or renounce her pay.

          • Luckily one does not have to trump the other

          • Stephanie, when one takes a government job, the rights of the citizens are paramount. Your personal feelings about an issue do not give you the right to deny to the citizens those services to which the citizens are entitled to receive from government. Especially when those services involve fundamental rights such as marriage.

          • gay marriage is not a fundamental right. the sup. court made it up. she was elected. freedom of religion is a fundamental right.

          • MARRIAGE in and of itself is a fundamental right. The equal protection clause says the states cannot discriminate against gay couples in applying their marriage laws.

            A government employee cannot use his/her personal feelings to deny a citizen access to a fundamental right which requires a service from government. In this case, a marriage license. Doing her job would in no way indicate personal approval from Kim Davis.

        • Dylan, the voters do not get to vote on matters involving fundamental rights. Marriage has been ruled to be a fundamental right, and the equal protection clause prohibits states from discriminating in the laws they choose to pass. There is no requirement that states license marriage. Since the states have chosen to do so, they cannot discriminate against their gay couples in issuing those marriage licenses. Get over it. It doesn’t affect your own marriage rights one smidgen.

      • If its really about equality, why does one partner in a same sex couple always pretend to be the daddy and the other the mommy?

        • Are you saying daddys and mommys aren’t equal?

          • Daddy’s and Mommy’s will NOT be “equal” until the “daddy” can give birth!!!

            My mom used to jokingly say that “if a man had to give birth to every second child, there would BE no overpopulation!!”

            And, for the record, I have TREMENDOUS respect and admiration for ANY dad who is raising a child on his own, for whatever reason.

        • That is not true, just you making crap up which is what the extreme right does all the time. Just make stuff up and make like it is true. Sorry I know many gay couples and I have never heard one say this one was the mommy and that one that daddy. Grow up.

          • And the Democrats NEVER “make up crap?”‘
            I suggest you look at Hillary’s, Ovomit’s, Reid’s, and Pelosi’s record, to name only a few.
            And, NO, I am NOT required to do your research for you.
            It’s right there on the Internet for all to see.

        • 🙂 it’s along the lines of the “ebonics” catch- phrase… ” You Be Da Man ” that is said by one lesbian to another…

      • Chief Justice Marshall carried out an anti-democratic coup when he decided that “it is legal for the courts to rule” as they desire, using the instruments of “equitable relief” to impose administrative ukases upon the American people.

        Winston Churchill said that the best argument against democracy was a five-minute conversation with an average voter. Mark Twain said that fools were a majority in every constituency. Whatever. SCOTUS is a conciliar court which is elitist and deeply anti-democratic. But this line of thought draws us into deep waters.

      • Try reading the Constitution Article III, sec. 1 here http://www.usconstitution.net/const.pdf and show me where they are allowed to make laws. Yes, their job is to rule on the “constitutionality” of a law or statute brought before them, but they DO NOT make law. The Federal or individual State Legislatures are the ONLY branches of government that are given that power. Period.
        Again, KY nor The Fed, Congress has written new law concerning marriage & how to handle it.
        Also, show me where in the 14th Amendment that it grants special groups special privileges. This Amendment has nothing to do with marriage (that’s a privilege left specifically to States, as it’s a state statute, not a federal) and nothing to do with a woman’s “choice” to murder a baby (also a State privilege).
        These are specifically State issues given to the States per Amendment 10. It is quite specific.

        • Mark,
          I am getting so tired of telling you guys that the court did not create a new law. What it said was that the portion of existing marriage laws that exclude same sex couples is unconstitutional. No new law just declaring parts of existing laws unconstitutional. The fourteenth amendment guarantee’s everyone equal rights. It is not some special group getting special privileges just making sure that same sex couples have the same rights as their straight counterparts. It is all about equality and not allowing discriminatory practices. So you are right the amendment has nothing to do with marriage but it does big time have to do with equality.

          • Exactly. If you’re saying this, then WHY are you responding negatively to my post?!? That’s what I’ve been saying for months now. SCOTUS cannot make law. BUT, the whole of the Feds and the sheeple are bowing their cumulative heads acting as if SCOTUS has!
            Davis is still acting under the only law that is before her. Neither KY nor the Feds have written anything different.

          • No Davis is not operating under the law. The portion of the marriage law that excluded same sex marriages was declared unconstitutional. So the law now in effect allows for the marriage of straight and gay couples. No law was created but portions of a law was ruled unconstitutional and is no longer relevant. KY nor the Feds have to write anything. Just draw a line on the statements in current law prohibiting same sex marriage.

          • So, no law, no lawlessness! All do as they please, as long as you’re progressive, nonChristian.
            You’re again roundly stating what I’m saying. No one has “straightened out” the laws. Let’s use abortion as an example, since it, too, was foisted upon us in similar manner. As shortly after SCOTUS ruled, several States had laws in place regulating the “practice”, of which many are still working through what’s law & what isn’t.
            It must needs be the same for this or any other SCOTUS decision, yet many act as if SCOTUS has “written law” into existence for ALL States, regulating ALL marriage regulations, etc.
            The Constitution STILL leaves marriage as a State regulatory, no matter what the SCOTUS says, so States still need to make their population’s desires known & act upon them as they have with abortion

          • No, what it says is that states can have marriage laws but they cannot in any fashion treat same sex couples different than opposite sex couples. If they do not want same sex marriages they have to eliminate marriage for straight couples as well. Do not think that will fly. So if they allow a straight couple to go to the county clerks office to get a marriage license then they have to allow a same sex couple that same right. States have no room to negotiate in this matter. Unlike abortion where there are time limits and different types of abortions when it comes to marriage it is that if they allow a straight couple a benefit then they have no choice but to offer the exact same benefit to same sex couples. Equality not special rights.

          • Here, sir, we are going to need to agree to disagree, for taking what you state to its logical conclusion, then I can marry my niece,my cat, my sheep. I can have whomever/whatever I wish as my “partner”. Do we abide by biological or physical “sexual orientation”, what about divorce, children, inheritance, etc?
            It is far bigger than just a guy wanting to bed another guy.
            By the way, thank you for the good discussion without name-calling.
            Refreshing, even if we’ve not wholly agreed.

          • I agree we agree to disagree. The decision by the court did not say you could do all the disgusting things you list. What it said is that same sex couples are entitled to the same benefits and rights as their straight couples enjoy. Same rules that apply to straight couples as regards divorce, children, inheritance, benefits, etc. apply to same sex couples as well. So like it or not same sex marriage is the law of the land and will be so for eternity. I agree I also appreciate no name calling. It gets no where.

          • G’nite,

          • G’nite also

          • At some point Mark you’re going to have to just except gay marriage is not going where.

            If you think you can put that genie back in the bottle,
            your even lower functioning that I have previously thought possible.

          • the reason why you don’t leave your comments open is people can come and post shit

          • the reason why you don’t leave your comments open is people can come and post shit.
            I thought a demonstration would make the point much better.

      • @RichWS, people take the 14 Amendment out of context. The 14Amendment was established for Blacks during the time of separation of education, stating the equality of Blacks. It has nothing to do with same sex marriage. Look it up in its full content. The left has taken it out of proportion for their use as all ways. The people need to become familiar with the Constitution in its entirety so they will know what the Amendments stand for and not be fooled by the left. The 14 Amendment was argued by T. Marshall for the Black schools to be desegregated. Look it UP!

    • Amen, we need to push back from every corner! This sick movement needs to stop! these mentally ill people need to go back into the closet!

      • Not according to reality check. Now he’s sounding like waynut calling people names when they ACTUALLY HAVE A SOLUTION and not just talk.

        • Your science education is out of date. Research indicates genetic transference with the mother passing the gene.

          • Then why are there identical twins with only one being homosexual or lesbian?

          • Because, identical twins are not identical in all things.

            One major difference is hormonal function.

            While external influences may be alike, internal forces are not always the same in both bodies.

            Do the research, I found it fascinating.

          • So then, even though the gene is there, it is not always successful? Doesn’t that stop the “born that way” story?

          • Birth defects are always possible. Hormone bath timing may be off. Mother may have not known she was pg and continued birth control pills. There are many “what ifs”.

          • Keep trying.

          • No. darling, it does not.

            When a man and woman with different eye colors have a child, which eye color will the child have?

            When you can answer that question, you will have the answer to your question.

          • Has nothing to do with the parents passing on genes. Identical twins are born with the same DNA, so therefor according to the “born that way” theory, either both twins would be straight or either lesbian or homosexual.

      • Homosexuality is a natural variation. It has been documented in 1,500 species.

        You, and your friends need to update your education.

        • It’s that stupid bixch, AK Lady again! What would this country be without stupid people like you?! Don’t talk to me about education, you idiot! I’ve had a long career as an educator, and I’m quite sure that I’m better educated than you are!

          • That would explain why the last two generations cannot read or write.
            Dear Roger, I am also an educator: college — graduate level.

          • Now THAT give us all confidence! What do you indoctrinate oh, um, sorry… teach? Women’s social standing in the gorilla family?
            Another perfect example of “education” not meaning a damned thing. Education does not mean you’re a thinker or innovative or knowledgible. Sorely, any more, it mostly means that you’ve been indoctrinated deeper into liberal/progressivism.

          • Accounting, calculus, chemistry and physics.

          • Impressive. I’ too, instruct Chemistry & Physics, but my studies & teaching have taught me more & more about the awesomeness of this wonderfully mysterious Creation God has made for us to explore, and that I myself (as has each & every human being, whether they accept it or not) have been wonderfully created with a “likeness” of God in me. No, not perfection – that’s reserved for God – but in being able to reason, to think, to express & to create. And to appreciate beauty. The longer I teach (25+ years), the more I explore, the more I realize how much God has done for each of us and for all of us.
            Oh, I graduated with MS/Science & Math from the VERY liberal Governors State Un, which at that time, was a branch of Chicago State, so my “education” was not from a religious school….

          • Once upon a time I was a Christian. I am now an agnostic.

            My eyes were opened, and I saw the hate and evil that was being preached.

            Almost all religions teach hate in one form or another, They are the scourge of mankind.

            More people have been murdered in the name of religion than for any other reason.

          • I’m sorry. That’s why neither God (nor Jesus) proclaimed or created religion. Religion is man trying to “reach out” to something they want as a higher power, This will lead to rules, regulations, control of the group, and living by “being good” or some sort of justification of works.
            Jesus’s way is a lifestyle, a changed heart. God asks of us not to be religious & join some specific church or sect, but to seek out a group of fellow-believers that know they’re sinners, within which we are meant to support each other, holding each other accountable & producing “fruit” as expressed in I Cor. 14, living by such teachings as ! Cor. 13, Romans 3:23 and others.
            I don’t know that I can disprove or even that I want to disprove your statement about murder & religion, except to remind you that without Christianity, you’d not have Western Civilization, many of the important beginnings of hard sciences were discovered by Acknowledged men of Christian Faith and that without Christianity, our world would be sorely different than it is – Beautiful music, art, sculpture. Inventions, humane forms of government, and again, Western Civilization.

          • Well stated. I don’t know why people have such a difficult time understanding that concept. Religion is a tradition that man developed. Man’s traditions make void the word of God. Faith in God is what counts, not some made up religion that changes based on a societal whim.

          • Thank you

          • Amen boy do you have it nailed some are blinded by man’s religion. One thing people don’t seem to understand is the Crusades were a response to Islams decades of plunder and murder but only lasted less than a decade. The vast majority of murder under the name of religion is by Muslims and continues today.

          • thank you

          • Yes. There have been many churches that killed people just like ISIS does if they did not turn to their way of thinking. In other words they converted through fear and torture and then made the ‘converts’ their slaves. Look at the Christian wars for example. The crusades were Christians who drove back the Muslims that were like Isis only it took them 300 years to fight back. It isn’t the rue Christians who killed people who make converts.. Check your history. Only ISIS and the C

          • Not where I went to school, thank God.

          • the reason why you don’t leave your comments open is people can come and post shit
            some of the more immature cons will go in and post a hundred stupid things.

            are you getting the point Mark?

          • Please name the school that employs you? Inquiring minds would like to know where NOT to let their kids attend.

          • Roger said it short and sweet. Now we know this fully developed 20 year old, is attempting to adversely affect all of her students with her immortal knowledge of the universe, and her understanding of the great documents written by our founding fathers, and who throws away the bible for her brand of idiocy and super human powers as a queer, man hater. Wow…

          • Twenty year old?

            How I wish.

            I expect I am older than you are..

          • That explains your left wing brain washed views! college is nothing more than a place to indoctrinate young adults! Fact!

        • So, we’re nothing but animals?!? Sorry, but I’m human being, created to be capable of higher learning, higher thinking, higher societal skills than mere animals. I choose to live a higher life, higher morals, higher mores than any animal is capable.
          And, just like I’ve challenged the craven Reality Check, why are you so ashamed of your crass blather that you hide behind the moniker?

          • Animals. Some are smarter than others.
            No, you do not choose a “higher life”. You are programmed by your genes.

          • I’m sorry that you’re so thin-skinned as to take what I wrote as insults. It was my modus operendi, what I believe about myself & what I express to loved ones, my several children & my students. If you choose the humanistic nihilist view of life, than that’s your choice.

          • Science provide evidence and facts. Religion does not.

          • Exactly!!!

          • I know a chimp that knows over a hundred words.
            he sounds smarter than you most days.

          • I know a chimp who know 101 words he is smarter than you all the time.

          • Ah, our friend RC! Wondered when you’d come out of your dark hole…
            I know a dog that knows a few words, too, but that doesn’t even come close. Even with the sorry state of our educational system, the average HS grad knows over 15,000. He’s got a way to go. Also, that chimp does not vocalize these words, he reacts to them, just as my dog reacts to me using the word “walk”.
            By the way, when’s the last time your chimp solved an algebraic equation or graphed the trajectory of a rocket or rebuilt the engine of his car?

          • my cat does not speak. My cat knows much more than AKLady. In fact an ant knows more than that queer. and that is one of the smallest little black ones.
            If her brains were the size of an ant’s brain the ant would win every time. She never even knew that our Nation originally was based on Christian Principles from the Bible as stated by the Founding Fathers. Even the sessions of our US Congress is started with a prayer, as is our state governments Congress.

          • the chimp signs, silly con.

          • So does my dog! No, actually he’s quite verbal….
            Again, though, hiding behind the moniker, you still ignore the gist of the statement and especially the last question.

          • no the chimp can’t work on cars or do higher math.

            what that has to do with “gay” being genetic, must be some form of con logic.
            do realize the similarity of our DNA and other animals?

            my demonstration of why you don’t leave your comments open was insufficient?

          • You’re the one who brought your “friend” chimp into the discussion.
            No one in any of my threads have talked about genetics, so I don’t know where you got that from!
            Yes, we all have DNA and millions of other cells that are similar. Do you realize that you’re 75% water? Does that make us water? All DNA has major similarities. That’s why it’s all DNA, duh! All cells have similarities, too. That’s why they’re called cells!
            I have no idea what your last blathering’s about, but I still challenge you to quit hiding under your rock & man up to your comments….
            Well, I guess if you ARE a man or a ze or transmetro or whatever

          • When was the last time a chimp almost destroyed the world with the push of a button.

          • Very funny!! LOL!!!

        • There is only one species created in God’s image and that is humans. Homosexuality is a choice which goes agains the natural creation. Self justification has been around since the begining of time. It was wrong then and it is still wrong today. The truth will set you free.

          • You are of the opinion there are no homosexual gods? How about women gods? Where are they?

          • AKLady: If you believe in the bible, reread the section where God said he made man in his image, male and female created He them. Based on what HE said, to be a GOD it takes two people to achieve that status — male & female. There are your female Gods. To answer your initial question, NO, there are NO homosexual gods. I’m glad you did not capitalize the word god in the context you were using. That would have been an affront to GOD

          • Genesis is a creation story which appears in the holy books of many religions, may of which date far earlier than the Bible.

            It is fiction. A story created by simple people to explain their existence. In the 21st Century, it is pure nonsense.

          • Oh yes. Little wiggly things coming out of the mud and becoming men is so much smarter. Or how about the Big Bang. Out of nowhere nothing happens and the whole perfect universe is created in total perfection. Science at it’s best.

          • However, it is a lot more complicated than you have depicted.

            The Bible just says it is done, it does not detail how It was done.

            You make light of the Big Bang, but again, the Bible does not provide details of the methodology God used.

            Hence, both can be, and are probably correct.

          • Your thinking is so ignorant, that I doubt you even have ignorance.
            Who are you to demand details?
            Just accept the fact that you were created in a world that was already created.
            Must have been created perfectly for anyone to exist.
            And you want to know how it was done, so that you can brag?
            If I were the creator: You would be the last person ever that should know the details.
            You would botch it all up into a flaming torch to destroy your creations. idiot.

          • It’s quite obvious from your comment , that you are totally lacking in your knowledge about Evolution. As AKLady said , it’s much more complicated than you have depicted. You really need to educate yourself before making anymore ridiculous comments.

          • And evolution was PROVEN by these great scientist you and AK speak of? All evolution is, is a stupid manmade idea about how man came to be by a man as stupid as you! I guess it is true, stupid is, as stupid does!!

          • “Out of nowhere nothing happens and the whole perfect universe is created in total perfection”

            Well that AND 15 BILLION YEARS.

          • The Big Bang and the story of creation in the Bible could be the same story.No time is mentioned for either. I know that God exists so do not need to fight the cause. I also know what Satan looks like . There is not another person on this Earth can make me believe any different.All I am saying is the stories are the same. They say the same thing except I am saying God created the universe or the Big Bang that created the universe. Reality check: Not my problem what you believe, and it isn’t your business what I believe. My job is to live my life how God wants, not argue with non- believers. Laughter.

          • The creation stories (2, actually) are myths, but it is pure nonsense to say that they are nonsense.

            Myths are how we condense and hand on simple truths to later generations.

          • Myths are how people, lacking science, explain things they need to understand.

          • Regardless – a book created through several translations as a guide to the behavior of mankind to love one another and to live under its principles for the advancement of civilization of which you have understanding, or even a suggestion of something better than the Bible to guide the behavior of mankind. You would try to convince me (and others) that such a good book should be thrown away and adopt your idiotic view of life?
            So, you set yourself up as a God? I don’t think so, and neither does any other thinking individual on this blog. None of us agree that your way is the only way…
            go back to school. Idiot.

          • Which book might that be?

            Your description apply to quite a few.

            Thrown away? No.

            Accepted as having many parts that are outdated? Most certainly.

          • I totally agree.

          • “Anyone might excusably have fallen in love with Narcissus, even as a child, and when he reached the age of sixteen, his path was strewn with heartlessly rejected lovers of both sexes, for he had a stubborn pride in his own beauty,” R. Graves, “The Greek Myths,” vol. 1.

            Echo was Narcissus’s beloved, of course. Anyone who watches TV should know the Greek myths, because pro athletes are even more shameless narcissists than news presenters and Hollywood ingenues. Echo, echo.

            One believes in a Deity, whose good news was incarnated in Jesus Christ, but one understands why 4/5 of the world think we are bonkers. Patience, brother, patience.

          • Blasphemy

          • IDIOT!!!

          • Really?

            Not under many other religions.

            You are another one of the “my religion is better than your religion” types.

            We also eat pork now.

            And we moved the
            Sabbath from Saturday to Sunday.

            Christmas is in December, even though Jesus was born in April.

            Little boys are now rarely circumcised.

            A lot of that there Blasphemy out there.

          • you are truly sick!!

          • Actually, homosexuals can and do breed. Sometimes prolifically. Otherwise, the gene would have died out with Alexander the Great and Julius Caesar. In fact, oftentimes homos make better parents than deadbeat dads who run around dropping trousers, depositing their seed and then beating a hasty exit.

            BTW, my “still behind” wants to know, yo: whose truth will set me free? And what is God’s image like? Male or female? Don’t tell me God’s image is transgendered, because that might make me question my faith.

        • jack sprat AKLady Queer’s
          are not natural and God will destroy them….

          • He has not yet. In fact He keeps on making more. You are confused.

          • Hope you continue to be thrilled when penetrated by AID’s carriers, both front and back.
            It is all natural for AID’s to be transferred through anal penetration. Then we can think of the Jenner transformation: removal of prick, and balls. Scrotum (with hair) jammed up inside and attached to pee hole, making a hairy snatch for you to suck, and such things are natural for the likes of you. now we have you defined… Thanks for all the negative comments of a communist, liberal, socialist idiot. I have enjoyed watching you make a total idiot of yourself, and you gave me great pleasure in researching all of your lies and fabrications of facts that you have spewn on this blog.
            Hope your life is shortened by your queer behavior, as this planet does not need any more of your spawn. Thank God. And, God Bless America.

          • Your ignorance and bigotry are an embarrassment to America.

            I would suggest you increase your medical/science education, but your mind seems to be closed.

            I suspect you consider yourself a Christian. The hate you express is typical of those who claim such membership.

        • So you equate homosexuals to animals that have no critical thinking ability? WOW

          • Are you a rock?
            Are you a carrot?

            No, you are an animal, a mammal.

            I hate to tell you thins, but your sexuality is programmed; just as your physical gender is programmed.

            Program errors occur in relations to physical gender.

            Why is it you believe that programming errors cannot take place in regard to sexuality and desire?

          • Let’s see about that: Why yes I was a male inside a woman’s body; however,
            My mother gave birth!
            Ohhh yeah, I have been in a woman’s body, several times, but I always pulled it out.

          • We are all animals, you moron.

          • The famous “religious” excuse for encouraging hate.

            Your hair color is programmed.

            Your eye color is programed.

            Your gender is programmed.

            Your sexuality is programmed.

        • independent thinker

          Provide proof that true homosexuality has been found in 1,500 species.

          • It is found in species that do not have females or few females. They go by sex urge. Maybe some gays do too but lots are just looking for love and inside their deep inner self they just hate the sex they are meant to be.They are not gay inside the womb.Their environment makes them gay like the animal species you were talking about. And while you are thinking this matter over “The fetus inside the womb. If they are gay in the womb they have a working brain so why are women the only person that can break the laws of God and man “Thou shalt not kill”, and murder the little babies inside them? They aren’t woman told to be responsible and use birth control? Why are they allowed to kill babies? Sacrifices. Gays are giving the excuses to calm their minds and hearts from guilt. Your sins are their power. The ones that follow the God of previsions and killing babies, and having sex with anything that moves.

          • If they are homosexual in the womb, it is part of human development, not a choice. Babies do not have the capacity to make such choices. The human brain is not fully developed until the 20s, later 20s for men. (no insult intended, just facts).

          • Wow… only women can think. Men can’t. Now, you show your colors…. idiot.
            On your 20th birthday, you have all the knowledge that you are willing to learn, instead of a continuing saga of learning new things when you are 90+…. You would waste 70 years and never learn anything more than on your 20th birthday… You really must be a queer. and an idiot.

          • Are you really equating being Gay with being an idiot ? You are the idiot & the biggest asshole on this forum.

          • Ignorant childish insults.
            Go for it.

            Science is so much more impressive than your opinions. You might try some once in awhile.

            Typical tactic of those without any facts — attack the person.

          • Get off your lazy A$$ and do you own research.

          • independent thinker

            In other words you have no proof that 1,500 species exhibit true homosexual behavior.

          • In other words, you are not interested in facts. You would rather hold on to your hate.

          • independent thinker

            If there was any proof to your claim you would be more than willing to provide it and would do so. Since you will not provide the proof it is logical to conclude there is none.

          • Just provide the facts, or is it 1,509 perhaps? or just 9? or none?
            Ahhhh there is one that I can think of: Sea Horse.

          • Likewise – you haven’t done yours, you make idiot statements

          • I have legal cases cited in law books. I’ve done my homework – quite well.

        • Homosexuality is Not natural.  For any species to survive, it must procreate! It is naturally impossible for two same-sex humans to procreate.  Homosexuality is in fact a scientifically counter-productive behavior as it pertains to the survival of our species and is therefore UNNATURAL. 

          • You better hurry up and tell the other 14,999 species — they do not seem to be aware of that. Oh, and you really should consider that homos sapien sapien is not the sole species that engages in intercourse for pleasure.

        • None of my relatives are queers. Must be that you are a queer. Naturally.

        • Homosexuality is a Choice.

      • Equality is a “sick movement”?

        • AKlady: define equality. And on what basis are you making that definition? That is the point. Your basis might be different than mine, therefore, who’s definition is correct and by what standard? Nobummmer declared that the US is no longer a Christian nation. On what information did he make that statement? As a practicing muslsime, he can say what he wants, that doesn’t make it right, but only to him. Queer (same sex) marriage is just that queer; it is not normal, just perverted. How do I make that determination? I believe in the biblical GOD. He told us that marriage is between ONE man and ONE woman; anything else is an abomination in His eyes. Anyone can say what they want about the subject. Are they correct? Depends on what and whose basis are they making that decision. The liberal choice is that of man’s definition The conservative choses the biblical definition. In my estimation, man’s law can never override biblical law. Have a glorious day.

          • The US has never been a Christian nation. The 1st Amendment makes that very clear.

            Period, end of story.

            Play your lie game with someone else.

            It offends many people when you play the nursery school name-calling game.

            Grow up. Act like the adult you claim to be.

          • AKL: two comments: ONE Excuse you for living. TWO GO back to a real school and learn the history of who the founding fathers were and on what basis they made the laws that govern our nation. Thank you and please go back to bed, its past your bedtime by quite a few hours.

          • The majority or the Founding Fathers were agnostics.

            America has never been a “Christian” nation.

            The wall between church and state is high, and solid. You really should read Thomas Jefferson’s writings.

            I do not know where you attended school, however, I do know this – you received a very slanted, falsified history education.

          • false. the Founding Fathers prayed before each session in the creation of our famous documents, in hopes their work and words would be blessed by God, in the furtherance of making this Nation great in the name of God. Your knowledge is so limited.

          • The majority of the early Presidents and patriots were Deists or Unitarians. Many were agnostic.

            The Treaty of Tripoli, passed by the U.S. Senate in 1797, read in part: “The government of the United States is not in any sense founded on the Christian religion.”

          • that is re-visionist history. i have seen the orig. documents. the whole sep. church and state came from a PRIVATE LETTER to a baptist minister. NOT the u.s. constitution. the court in the 60’s turned the first amendment on it’s head, citing absolutely NO precident!!

          • That is very arrogant of you. I have also seen original documents. The majority of the Founders were agonistic.
            I repeat America has never been a Christian nation. The 1st Amendment attests to that fact. Live with it.

          • You cannot rewrite history to your support your views.

            Separation of the Church and State is law – period, end of argument.

            The First Amendment guarantees freedoms concerning religion, expression, assembly, and the right to petition.

            It forbids Congress from both promoting one religion over others and also restricting an individual’s religious practices.

          • Yes dad, I agree

          • The great documents of our founding fathers and citations to law, show you are one of the Obozo’s minions. Sorry that you haven’t bothered to research your spew so that you would not look like and act like a communist. I pity the likes of you.

          • I pity the likes of you. You are a true Christian Bigot, just like your buddy Kim Davis. All you have done on this forum is spew hate & intolerance towards people who just so happen not to share the same beliefs that you do. You are mean spirited & love to insult people with your name calling, especially towards AKLady. You need to apologize to AKLady. If not, you need to take your hate, bigotry & filthy mouth somewhere else. You’re not wanted here!!! It is people like YOU who give Christians a bad name.

          • You are poorly informed to an extreme.

            Our Founders were not Christians – they were Deists and Unitarians.

            You need to go back and hit the history books.

          • See what I mean! She calls people names then states: it offends many people when you play nursery school name calling game. Then she tells them to grow up,ACT like the grownup your’re suppose to be. This is how they are when others beliefs aren’t their beliefs. Tell you anything?

          • Do you believe that name calling is adult behavior?

          • AKLady,
            Better read the First Amendment again. It says that the government shall not legislate against religion. It would not say such a thing if it was against religion. You should spend some time reading up on the Constitutional Congress and how they came by some of their decisions on what the Constitution says.

          • Assume, assume, assume, I have studied Constitutional Law.

          • AKLady,
            I was not referring to Constitutional law. I was referring to Constitutional history.

          • Jerry, the Founders were Deists and Unitarians. Madison penned the Constitution. He was a Deist.

          • ALKady,
            The Constitutional Convention had people from every colony represented. Every colony was founded on eh fact that they came to this country to escape religious persecution in Europe and/or to be free to worship God as they sought fit to do. A whole lot of discussion took place before Madison actually penned the document. Two members of the convention had a document they presented. Those were Benjamin Franklin and George Washington. That document was a basis for much of what went into the Constitution itself.
            The Bill of rights came afterward.

          • The majority of the Founders were Deists and Unitarians. – not Christians.

            They understood very well that freedom of religion includes freedom from religion.

          • AKLady,
            Nice try but at the convention every colony was represented.

          • AKLady,
            At the convention every colony was represented and every colony had to ratify the Constitution including the Bill of Rights in order to be admitted to the Union..

          • You are confused.

            “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof …”

          • AKLady,
            Yup, that is what the First Amendment says. Any legislation that interferes with religion or denies it is a no no. The last I checked the word, against, that is what it is about.

          • A Jewish grocery clerk refuses to check out a customer who has a package of pork chips on the check out counter.

            Would that be “practice of religion” ?

            Exactly the same as the Davis situation.

          • AKLady,
            Well, Muslims complain about pork chops in restaurants. In this case, I do not know. I am sure there are Jewish clerks in grocery stores. I am not aware that it is a problem. But this is an individual issue between a person and their beliefs. As a Christian I could care less what PGBT people do. It is none of my business. I supported their right against discrimination on the basis of the Constitutional Bill of Rights. But I do not take part in any of their personal activities. Supporting their rights under the Constitution is one thing and engaging in their activities is another. I do not judge them nor do I have any reason to dislike them. I have never met one I did not like, actually. I get along with them just fine.

          • I’ve never known a Muslim that complained about pork chops at resturants. Never knew a Jew that did either.

            The Jewish and Islamic dietary laws were put in place for health reasons. The forbidden foods posed major health risks – tapeworm being very high on that list. Swine were fed garbage.

            Today, those laws still provide a high degree of protection in many third-world countries.

          • AKLady,
            I have never known of any Jewish people to complain about restaurant menus but Muslims do and I saw it on the news. I do not eat pig meat myself. I have to stay on a leaner diet.

          • Modern pork is quite healthy. It is as lean a chicken.

          • AKLady,
            Actually I do not eat much beef either. It is what they are fed. But even chickens are fed stuff that is not good for anyone. Even fish are not that good depending on where the fish comes from. But my meat choices are fish and chicken.

          • You are making a fool of yourself before the world. Separation of church and state has always been the foundation of this country. The Founders insisted upon it, having had the opportunity of seeing horrible conditions in other countries.

          • The law defines equality. Suggest you read it.

            Name calling is infantile. Act like an adult if you want your opinions’ respected.

            Grow up. Act like a mature adult.

          • Hello AKLady and JobRon:
            It is clearly stated by Supreme Justices, that America (USA) was founded on Christian principles. Even Wickipedia confirms this. So, here are the references. There is no argument.

            The case is famous for Justice Brewer’s statements that America is a “Christian nation.”

            These, and many other matters which might be noticed, add a volume of unofficial declarations to the mass of organic utterances that this is a Christian nation. 143 U.S. 457 (1892)

            In a 1905 book titled: “The United States: A Christian Nation”, Justice Brewer explained further:

            In his first chapter, Justice Brewer further explains the Christian founding of America. His second chapter explains the Christian duty of citizens to America to ensure the advancement of the nation under biblical and Christian principles. He argues that civilization is dependent upon the advocacy of Christianity, and to the degree that citizens
            are willing to advocate these principles, to that degree they and the nation will be blessed. Finally, Justice Brewer argues that the world will be blessed, not primarily through material advances, but through allegiance to the principles of Christ that transforms the individual, the family, the nation, and the world.
            References:
            Full text of Church of the Holy Trinity v. United States, Justia.com
            Eidsmoe, John (1995). Christianity and the Constitution: The Faith of Our Founding Fathers. Baker Academic. ISBN 0-8010-5231-9.
            Brewer, David (1905). The United States A Christian Nation. The John C. Winston Company. p. 12.
            491 U.S. 471 (1989)

            This subject is over. Sorry; however, our nation is and was originally based on Christian principles. A prayer is spoken before Congress. The halls and front entrance to the United States Supreme Court proclaim these facts, and above the Justices: “In God we Trust” which is on every penny, dollar bill, and in grave yards every where. We are a Christian Nation – not Muslim. These facts can not be disputed.

            As a Christian Nation: Queers being married in the name of the State is wrong:
            “And by the power vested in me by the State of _______, I now pronounce you Man and Wife.” Please explain where it was wrong for Kim to insert the words: “as ordered by the court” is wrong? That is the question. So, stop the rant, and accept well settled law that we are a Christian Nation, and the decision by the Supreme Court to allow queers to marry is not in keeping with that which has already been decided.

          • The majority of the Founding Fathers were Deists and Unitarians.

            Others, like Jefferson, were agnostic.

            Apache — you need to get your history books back out.

            The U.S. was not founded on “Christian” anything.

            The U.S. is not now, nor has it ever been a “Christian” nation.

          • “It is clearly stated by Supreme Justices, that America (USA) was founded on Christian principles. Even Wickipedia confirms this. So, here are the references. There is no argument”.

            First, we would be considered a Judaeo-Christian nation if your comment wss to be truly relivant.

            Finally, as a college professor, Wikipedia is not considered to be an acceptable source of information to cite for research purposes.

          • And Obozo is a liar. This is a Christian Nation, It was founded on Christian principles. Prayers were conducted before each session in writing the famous documents, in the hope that our Nation would be blessed. Queers have no respect for our Country or our Constitution, or our laws. Obozo intended to place Amity between the Citizens for his own agenda. AKLady and JobRon are pitted against each other in compliance with the wrongful agenda of Obozo. Everyone on this post knows this to be true.

          • You’ll never get this person to understand or believe apache. There’s one like this on every site. They’re not American’s. They’re Muslims being fed the information in order to change YOUR beliefs and faiths. They’re enjoying it,don’t bother with them.

          • The U.S. is not now, nor has it ever been a Christian nation.

            The Founders were Deists and Unitarians. Jefferson was an agnostic.

            Jefferson authored the majority of the “famous documents”, including the Constitution.

            You sir, have no respect for either the Constitution or those who fought and died to make this Nation.

          • “Nobummmer declared that the US is no longer a Christian nation.”

            we NEVER WERE.
            that would be your really big problem.
            you should listen to the Lady.

          • RC: Nobummmmer innocent: every time he opens his mouth he fulfills his promise that HE is going to fundamentally change the USofA. That is not a lie. Look at what the US was and now is under his misguided hand. As far as being a Christian — why has he worn on his left ring finger since he was 19 a ring that states “there is no god but allah,” if he is a Christian. Oh, that’s right muslimes can lie to infidels to help convert them to that perverted way of life. As far as the US not being Christian, why did the Founding Fathers “pray to God” before the Constitution was finally written? Nothing seemed to work until they started praying. Semantics work wonders for you don’t they.

          • Sorry Reality Check:
            Obozo knew we were a Christian Nation. That is why the liar declared otherwise.
            For his own agenda to destroy America (USA) as a Muslim.
            Idiots approve of his destruction, until something happens that would show they made a huge mistake in trusting the foreign born Muslim, extremist, idiot, pot smoking, community organizer, UN-patriotic, hater of America, who never worked a day in his life.

          • “As a practicing muslsime”

            See, that’s also a LIE and GOD hates lies on the internet.

            at least a dozen of the people YOU are gong to vote for President have come out and said Job is low info and Obama is a Good Christian and a Good American.

            That turns RobRon in an unpatriotic LIAR who posts HATEFUL things on the internet about an innocent man (Obama in case you are not following)

      • @rjet43, they may be hidden from man, but they are not hidden from God. for this is abomination onto the Lord they God, and in the end they will see it when they are casted into the Lake of Fire. God says Repent so they shall be saved, but those that do not are doing the work of Satan! The Truth Be Told!, which they don’t care about the Truth. They care about pleasure and greed!

        • Your god is not necessarily other people’s god. You keep forgetting that fact.

          • @AKLady, I agree my God is not necessarily other people’s God and no I did not forget that. That was my point. Those that do not believe in the God above will be sitting in the Lake of Fire. My job is to tell of God and those that do not believer will be Judged by God!. It is not intended for me to make someone believe it is to spread the word and Gospel of God! Whether you accept or not that will be on them.

          • No, Shelia, you are playing the “my god” is better than “your god” game.
            By just engaging in that game, you are sitting in judgment of people.
            No, it is not your right, or your duty, to impose your beliefs upon others. Doing so is incredibly rude.

          • I would rather live my life as if there is a God,
            And die to find out there isn’t,
            Than live my life as if there isn’t,
            And die to find out there is.

          • I do not need the specters of reward and punishment to live life in a socially acceptable manner.

          • As much as you feel there is no need of spectators: what will you do upon judgement day when the Lord returns to judge you, and then rejects you for your arrogance, and pride; and then He decides to cast you out of His kingdom because of it? For God is the greater judge, and we will all be judged by Him, for then it will be to late if He came tomorrow and did not repent!

          • Because it is not going to happen. You have the absolute right to be believe, but don’t lord it over us who do not. Sorry about the pun.

          • Frankly, I think “god” if there is one, will respect honesty more than fear.

            I am certain He will respect the life far more than the “I believe”.

            Your post is a prime example of why I am no longer a “Christian”.

            Oh, and by the way, I have another statement that will play with your mind: The most Christian person I have ever known was a Hindu.

            May you learn the true meaning of Christianity before it is too late, and you must face the judge.

          • Good works, without faith is VOID!!

          • Your post is a prime example of why I am no longer a “Christian”.

            May you learn the true meaning of Christianity before it is too late, and you must face the judge.

          • We two need not apparitions — “the specters” –of reward and punishment to live life in a manner acceptable to our families, friends and neighbors. What you are saying, I presume. But it helps some people to feel part of a larger community. An institutional church provides that sense for some people.

            The gregarious instinct in people is not to be lightly dismissed.

          • Who is always there to feed the hungry,clothe them.,help with utilities,rent? Because I don’t think your deity group does. But my church hands out groceries out by the ton every week. We are able to provide for others because we pray,we give tighs, we come together to love and provide for others that would starve. In the name of our God. What does yours do?

          • By the way of clarification. You give “tighs”?

            I assume that you give tithes, not thighs.

            Ten percent (10%) is what I give in a lean year, but I don’t always channel it through my church, a source of anguish to those who prefer to skim a bit of cream off the top.

            So many institutional “humanitarians” simply steal from Peter in order to pay Paul. Bless you, Paula, if you do indeed hand out your very own groceries and don’t act as a mere conduit for money handed out by the ton to tax-free foundations. What really counts is checking on one another, taking time to become a friend and neighbor to those in need. Blessings.

          • You mean like the Clinton Foundation where 90% of the donations goes to one charitable party, the Clintons?

          • That is not true.

            Why do you believe it is acceptable to lie?

            Why do you believe it is acceptable to repeat lies?

          • What do you know about TRUTH??? When you live in DARKNESS???

          • There are the brainwashed.

            The there are those who are not brainwashed.

            Darkness is a matter of opinion.

          • Thank you for the correct spelling. And yes I do help with groceries and such as to spread it around to keep temptation out of the way and have been chastized for it. I even give to children when at the stores when their parents can’t afford. Talk about me, call me names,put me down BUT never my God!

          • I do, I give my time to those who need my expertise. Sometimes, time is far more valuable than goods.

          • My group contributes about 15% of their paycheck.
            That contribution pays for food, clothing, shelter and medical care.
            On top of that, my group donates time to educate. We teach people how to fill out job applications … how to dress for job interviews

            , even help them practice for interviews.
            We even teach them how to do simple jobs.

          • All religions have a social factor, you can say the same thing about a synagogue, temple, mosque, preaching hall, etc. Religion is a social construct with communities. What some tend to forget is that for Christianity traditionally, 99.9% of humanity will be going to Hell. Say if you live anywhere from 50 years before the coming of Jesus and Christianity, down to 135,000 years with the first homo sapiens – all of them are traditionally see as going to Hell because they were not Christians. For people that you know that live ethical and moral lives, what you might call ‘saintly,’ lives, but they happen to be Jewish- well, have fun in Hell.
            Now there are Christian theologians and denominations that don’t take that view – but that is what you have with fundamentalist and some evangelical Christians.

          • Morgan,
            Unfortunately what you say about many Christians are true but they are also very misunderstood by non Christian people. I have posted on this before. No one, not even God, sends anyone anywhere. Where they spend eternity is solely based on believing in God or not believing. That is a choice. What is hell? It is a place for those who reject God. He created the place but never sends anyone there. It is destined for complete eradication. But it is a choice, without any help from God or any human.

          • For some it is actually no choice. Again, for those who could never have become Christians because the religion didn’t exist yet, will go to Hell. However, for some forms of Christianity and also some evangelical Christians, everything is according to the will of God and so he has the ability to save others. You have for example, the Roman Catholic tradition that for those who do the work of Christ, helping the widow, the orphan, the downtrodden, they are doing Christ’s work and they might be saved.
            As for Hell, the various denominations have different understandings. For some Hell is not a physical place but a spiritual experience – that is you no longer and can no longer have union with God. For others it is a physical place, where you will either be physically (?) tortured or spiritually/psychotically tortured. For some evangelical theologians, they understand that those in Hell will not be tortured for all eternity but that eventually they will no long exist. Kind of God putting them out of their misery.
            A really good book on this is The Four Views of Hell by, Crockett, Pinnock, et all. Three evangelical theologians and one Roman Catholic. The present their individual views and then debate each other.

          • Mogan,
            Sorry I misspelled your name before. My computer has a glitch in it. There is a loose screw in the button puncher.
            As for hell, I take the Bible version of hell. It is somewhat different than Catholics or Seventh Day Adventists. It was originally created for a depository for Lucifer, the fallen angel we find called Satan. The fallen angel chose to make himself like God and be equal with Him. That did not fly with God. so Satan got booted out of Heaven and deposited in hell or hades, if you like. Satan has been allowed to roam the earth seeking converts to him and against God. Those who choose to follow Satan go to the same place. Jesus likened hell to a garbage dump. Some dumps burn, depending on the contents of the dump. so that is the Biblical definition of hell.
            Since Adam and Eve, choice has been available to humans. We make them. If we choose to seek God, we are rewarded with an eternity with him. If we reject Him we go to the only other place that is an option and that is hell. Jesus did offer a parable about the rich man and Lazarus but the point was that it was not a pleasant place.
            Yes, different denomination s within Christianity have differing viewpoints of how the get to heaven or hell. Jesus clarified that in the gospels. We, like Adam and Eve, are free to make choices – God or Satan. That is it. Jesus made it clear that no special “works” on our part was going to help as heaven is a choice and cannot be earned. It is granted by the grace of God. That is what I read in the Bible in many places. Jesus told Nicodemus that he needed to be born of the Spirit. Nicodemus did not understand. But the whole of what makes one a Christian is found in I John, the whole of chapter 5.

          • John Milton describe the fallen Angel,Satan in Paradise Lost.

          • Steve,
            I vaguely remember that. Josephus also wrote about Hades and it comes from the words of Jesus on that topic. Josephus was a Jewish historian and made little mention of Jesus except that Jesus did exist. My point is that there are other writings beside the Bible on many Biblical issues and morality.

          • Beautifully stated, and succinct. Thank you.

          • sweetqueen,
            You are welcome.

          • Wrong about what?

          • Perhaps you should read more of your Bible, and less modern fiction. “By Faith”, those in the old testament were saved, because they believed in the Christ to come. You had best study the ORIGINAL manuscript…The Holy Bible.

          • There are many gods.

            There are many religions.

            I believe hell is of your own making — right ere on earth.

            Faith is not the balance factor.

            How you live your life is far more important than what imaginary being you believe in.

          • And, THAT is everyone’s RIGHT, here in America. There is no reason for anyone to ram their beliefs down anyone else’s throat. If a service provider does not want to provide a service, of any sort, for any reason, JUST GO TO SOMEONE ELSE,, who will be more than happy to accept your money.

          • Except Davis is not a service provider.

            She is a government employee.

          • On the surface, I agree with you. However, she IS an ELECTED employee of the County, and if the VOTERS do not appreciate her performance, she will be out of a job with the next election. Somehow, I doubt that they will oust her. So, however I feel personally, the ELECTORATE will take care of this issue. And, as long as there is someone else in that office who can sign the licenses, WHO CARES???

          • That is the part you seem to have missed. She would not allow others to do their job. As County Clerk, she was the “boss”, “supervisor” – I control.

          • You must be young.
            Too young to remember the “Whites Only” signs.

          • Many gods and many religions. Only one GOD and Christianity is not a religion, but a relationship with that GOD. Your last three sentences are not exactly correct.

          • Christianity is a business. A very big, very profitable business.

          • AKLady,
            Certainly how we live our lives is of value. And yes, there have been many religions over time from sun gods to you name it. But so far none have been based on a real person who did live in the time period that occurred. Jesus dwelt on faith and not works. He also made an issue of Spiritual birth, which is absolutely necessary in understanding the sum of Christianity. But again, that was my choice and note one that everyone chooses to engage in. I have stated that before but I do not beat anyone over the head with any Christian issues. That is not my job. My task is to simply tell the story of Christian belief and my own experiences as a Christian. The rest is up to you.
            Back in my college days I did read about and checked into the old sun gods and other such beilefs. But I never found anything substantial to them and have not given them any thought since.

          • Gautama Buddha was a very real person. Eastern religions are all about “spiritual birth”.

          • Eastern religions are about self achievement. Jesus was not.

          • Honest living, caring for the poor … I’m not so sure I would call that self-achievement. All of the Eastern religions focus on humaneness.

            Christianity is far more self-centered. It is all about the individual and his/her relationship to a God.

          • AKLady,
            You are correct in that Christianity is about individuals. But it is not about any specific individuals. Eastern religions are about self gratification.

          • Your statement about “self-gasification” says you know little to nothing about most non-Semitic religions.

          • AKLady,
            I know enough about eastern religions to know that they are quite contrary to the Bible. Since humans are fallible they cannot and do not gain any eternal life on their own. All humans are fallible. That is demonstrated in human behavior daily.

          • Read John Milton”s Paradise Lost.

          • Steve,
            I did read I long ago. I remember little about it. But since you mention it, I should maybe look it up.

          • You are slightly confused. It is a bit more complicated.

            Whether or not you go to heaven is based on acceptance of Jesus
            Christ as your “savior”.

            Believing in God is no linger enough to get you through the Pearly Gates.

          • Even the demons BELIEVE, and they surely will NOT see heaven. In the end, many will call upon Him, and He will say, “Depart from me, for you never KNEW me.”

          • Christianity the religion of threat, fear, power, control …
            You speak eloquently in support of the truths I have written.

          • AKLady,
            As I recall, Jesus was put to death because He said He was God. So, faith in Jesus is faith in God. See how easy that was? And yes, He said He was also Savior.

          • Jesus never claimed to be God.

            “Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help.” Psalms 146.

            “I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word. Now they have known that ALL THINGS whatsoever thou hast given me are of thee. 8 For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me” John 17:6-8: 6

          • AKLady,
            I thought you had learned your lesson about engaging me on specifics of the Bible. You should have kept going to verses 21-23. Then go on to John 19:7. Also, see Matthew 26:63-64. I am, of course, reading this from the Greek. The Jewish priesthood understood that Jesus was saying He was God whether you think He was or not.

          • “You have said so,” Jesus replied. “But I say to all of you: From now on you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven.”

            Matthew 26:64

          • AKLady,
            That verse says what it says. But it is far from the only verse. The overall message from Jesus Himself is that He is God. I gave you a couple of those. I can find more. Jesus was not.
            In Matt. 26:63, Jesus answered the high priest by saying, You have said it yourself. Jesus had a mission and that was His sacrifice for us. Therefore, He did not pursue the issue of His divinity. Matt. 16:27 also says Son of Man. But then He says He is of His father, God.

          • Jesus never said he was God.

            People, such as yourself have interpreted some scripture to mean that, but it is a false claim. During his lifetime, Jesus himself didn’t call himself God and didn’t consider himself God.

            Christians are actually polytheists. The sidestep the 1st Commandment by inventing the three-in-one deity.
            Theology is not history.

          • AKLady,
            Interpret? I quotes specific scripture. There is no interpretation to it. There is no sidestepping the First Commandment, which says worship of God. I think I see where you are getting this denial of the trinity nonsense. You apparently have learned that from Unitarians. I go by what the Bible literally says, not what some folks cook up.

          • Really?
            You are fluent in Hebrew, Aramaic, Arabic, Greek and Latin?

          • AKlady,
            Why so many languages? The Old Testament is in Hebrew and the New Testament is in Greek. Aramaic is just added words that did not exist in the original Hebrew. The original Hebrew did not have vowels. It is a Linear A language. The later versions have symbols for vowels above and below the line of vocabulary. By the way, I still have my class study text material. Especially when discussing the New Testament, I specifically use the Greek version.

          • AKlady,
            I quote scripture just as Jesus taught us to do. I do not
            “interpret” anything.
            John 1:1-3 says, In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God and Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things came into being by Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being.
            Where did John get that idea? Did he just invent it? Or was it because he was a faithful disciple of Jesus who witnessed His death, heard and heeded His message and observed His resurrection?
            Where did the Jewish priesthood get the message that Jesus claimed to be God? After all, that is why they wanted Him dead. Pilate also took up that idea as well as he decided Jesus was a threat to Roman rule. So it is just not me that believes Jesus intentionally said He was the Son. Notice that when Jesus said He was the Son of Man that Man is capitalized.

          • Don’t preach.
            It is actually quite rude.

          • AKLady,
            I do what Jesus did. I quote scripture. I do not care for misleading statements on any topic, especially the Bible. So I will call you on it anytime I find it.

          • Yes, many so-called Christian sects teach that hate. They are not Christians.

          • You do not HATE sin –you do not LOVE God!!! Read and WEEP–Repent!!

          • What god???? Have you ever seen him or her ? If the answer is yes, then you are either delusional or having hallucinations. I would get a brain scan as soon as possible. You Christians are too funny. LOL!!!

          • You are not the standard of AUTHORITY!! If anything an Athiest!! History and WITNESSES are the PROOF—THE FACT of people who SEE all CREATION confirms HIS REALITY–But closing your eyes and BABBLING Unbelief is a sign of the FOOL!! Nobody with any intelligence would listen to you!! Go take your own advice—FOOL!!

          • Have you ever seen a Germ? Have you ever seen bacteria? Have you ever seen wind? Have you ever seen sound? Have you ever seen ether waves? Then you have never been sick or felt the wind or heard anything or anyone or watched a television

          • Correct.

          • I don’t know any Christian that believes that people before Christ were going to hell. In the Bible we find out that as time went on, some things did change. For a long time there were no laws (rules) as to righteous living. Then along came Moses and he was given the ten commandments; then we find that people could not keep all the law. That is were Jesus and grace and mercy came about. Now we are commanded to love GOD and our fellow man. If we do that, all other laws will be followed. We want kill him, steal from him, lie about him, covet his “stuff” (I am speaking of our neighbor)

          • That is why gangs are so popular in impoverished neighborhoods.

            Religions, or should I say, congregations are simply socially-acceptable gangs.

          • It helps some to feel superior to others.

            It also can cause deep rifts between Christian and non-Christian.

            It has also been used as justification to murder.

          • Socially acceptable doesn’t matter if it is not GODLY.

          • Rules are rules.
            Religion is simply another level of power and control.

          • You say “rules are rules”. Following mans’ rules is most assuredly a level of power and control! Here’s your sign…STUPID!!

          • So its not that you believe in god, you just say you do, just in case.

            What a shitty way to live your life

          • So , Steve is not a true Christian, like he claims. He lacks true faith, which by definition is believing in something or someone, without proof or evidence. It’s more like blind faith & it is definitely a very shitty way to live your life.

          • You queers are just insane people…You need help.I pray that you get it.

          • I believe GODS word, he made man and woman to be able to go forth and multiply, if he intended for faggots to rule the earth, they would have died out a long time ago and the earth would be ruled over by nothing but animals. I do know it is written that in the last days man will get smarter but weaker. People need to read 2nd. Timothy chapter 3, it explains a lot as to why people try to persecute true believers in Christ, they are profane and blasphemers, and non believers of Christ. They deep down inside know they are wrong but they won’t even admit it to themselves, so they lash out at those of us who do believe in GODS mercy and banishment. I for one try to over look their ignorance provided to them by the greatest deceiver(SATAN). I do know that they will call me arrogant and stupid for what I have written, but I could care less what they think as I’ll be in Heaven with my Jesus, while they are in the lake of fire burning for all eternity. You can lead a horse to water but you cant make him drink, the same with unbelievers, you can tell them about Jesus but you cant make them believe. So Gene I agree with you.

          • I can only imagine that someone like you who has NO FAITH except in yourself would surely be an authority on having a “shitty life!”

          • Faye, Your getting close to being Judgmental and that’s not what a

            true christian does…

          • FYI, I am not a Christian, I am an Atheist & proud of it. Most Christians on this & other forums are very judgmental towards people like me who don’t believe in your false god or that ancient book you call the word of god. As nonbelievers, we have every right to challenge & question your ridiculous beliefs. You Christians are making the claim that your god really does exist & the bible is true, without any proof or evidence, whatsoever. Saying it’s so, doesn’t make it true.

          • I try to live my life as God’s son would want me. I pray for giveness and thanks every day. My faith is slightly larger than a mustard seed, how big is yours. And it isn’t a MY “shiity way” to live. Yes I believe in God through BLIND faith, I have no other choice, than NOT to believe and end up with Satan.

          • Belief based on fear is not belief. 😉

          • What do you know about FAITH???? Absolutely NOTHING!!! Out of Mercy towards you—“The FEAR of the LORD is the beginning of WISDOM and to depart from EVIL(Gay Lifestyle) is understanding.” Obviously you do not know evil and are lost in darkness, I will pray for you–that you see the Light and REPENT!!

          • Your religion teaches you to live your life in fear. I feel sorry for you. YOU are a slave to your false god & then to say you have no other choice, but to believe in some invisible being, based solely on the premise that if you don’t you will be spending eternity with satan, burning in hell. No different than being sentenced to life in prison for the rest of your life. YOU do have a choice, but you just can’t see it because you are blinded by faith. You need to take control of your own life & stop being a slave to a supernatural being that no one to this day, has ever proved really does exist.

          • As science advances and makes known the unknown, the need for such fairy tales will go by the way side. Until then, I wish you the best, and I hope your fairy tale has a fairy tale ending

          • Matt 17:20 and there are six other scripture of having faith in MY Bible

          • You are being judgmental but that is typical of a Liberal who thinks they can dictate to everyone else how they are to believe. What difference does it make to you if I believe in God or not? It does not affect you. But your decisions you want to impose up me does affect me and other people also.

          • She’s not sueing someone who refuses to serve her wicked ways nor demanding that person be punished for having/following their belief but you are so…..Who’s being judgemental? It’s your way or punishment!! That’s VERY arrogant if you ask me!

          • So is a person to go through life without making judgements? If you are so inclined you need to reassess your life. It is just that my judgements do not agree with yours that make you peeved. I ultimately make my decisions in life based on my judgements. Maybe you need to read the good Book to see what life is all about. But you will not do that because then you would have to change. Kim is the one who is being judged unjustly because she does not want to comply with the whims of the perverts. The judge, the homos did not have to go to jail. BTW when you stand before God you can tell Him He is arrogant and I will watch and see how far it gets you. BTW I said nothing about punishments. God works ON a REWARDS SYSTEM.

          • This was not suppose to be a response to you, sorry, but to AK lady who thinks Christians are arrogant and judgemental! At least we, as Christians, don’t sue someone or try to demand their job if they don’t agree with our worldly views and beliefs! I am a Plus size woman, if I go to the 5-7-9 (Store only carries size 5, 7 and 9 clothes)store in the mall and ask them where is the plus size section, they would look at me like I was crazy! So, am I suppose to call my lawyer and start a lawsuit or have the clerk fired because they don’t carry my size??!! NO!!! I shop until I find the store that has what I need, not look for one that “DISCRIMINATES” against me so I can sue them or demand my rights that they carry my size!! That’s called vengefulness, so there you go, one sin leads to another!!

          • I can tell you, by the fact, that he capitalized God, that he believes in the One True God.

          • That is your choice. However, you should not try to make that choice for others.

          • What you’re referring to is Pascal’s Wager. If you’re not familiar with it , you can Google it. So what you’re really saying is that you’re not totally convinced there is a god, but you’re hoping god will be there when you die. I thought Christians based their belief in god on faith ? Have you lost yours or did you ever have it in the first place ?

          • That is correct; the homosexual couples should not try to impose their beliefs on Mrs. Davis. Glad you feel that way.

          • Nothing worse than a persecuted community wanting their full rights. What are the beliefs of homosexuals? They believe that they have the same civil rights as any other American. That’s scandalous.. There is only one person imposing her rights and that is Davis.

          • Amen.
            Exactly.

          • I have my moments

          • That you do, 😉

          • You are quite wrong. Davis is a public servant. She is the one in the wrong. If she cannot serve the entire public, she needs to resign.

          • Homosexuality is not a belief.

            Homosexuality is not a choice.

            Humans aren’t the only species that has same-sex pairings.

          • A County Clerk is a government employee which serves thw public.

            As such, Davis may not bring ANY PERSONAL RELIGIOUS BELIEF TO THE JOB.

            Davis violated the law.

          • AKLady Would you leave it alone. I know what you stand for. She has said that other people in her office can issue them. If this was a Muslim lady, you would be backing her. If you want to get the last word, go on, I am thru with this topic. May GOD bless you. Mrs. Davis is not a hater, but she does love the FATHER; and I certainly do not mean the pope.

          • Mrs. Davis is a hater.

            She judges people.

            Science is clearly documenting the fact that homosexuality is not a choice.

            But, hey, you know the earth is only 5,000 or 6,000 years old and man walked with the dinosaurs.

          • AKlady,
            No, dear lady, Shelia is not playing the “my god is better” game. She is playing the game of speaking out on what her God says. She is not advocating anything but a message. She said nothing about legislating what she believes. I think you need to pay more attention to what someone says rather than espouse your version of beliefs. You are entitled to your own choices on the issue of beliefs but you are trying to belittle someone for theirs. It seems to me that you are at some sort of odds with Christianity with a vengence.

          • Ever Christian plays the ‘my god is better’ game.

          • AKLady,
            That may be your idea but it is not mine. I have found no other gods to believe in. So how can my God be better than no gods at all? I have looked at the old gods of Greece and other middle eastern countries and I see no real evidence that such gods even existed.

          • Their is ONLY one God!! And there are people like you “WHO HATE GOD”

          • Hate God?

            Assume, assume, assume — typical.

            You are a prime example of why I am no longer part of the Christian lie.

          • You are the PRIME Example of playing the BLAME GAME!!!

          • I did not blame you for anything. I simply pointed out your abject intolerance of other religions.

          • Man-made religions are False–Deception–LIES–and are equated with IDOLATRY–Which ELOHIM said in the written tablets!!!! TRUTH before tolerance!!!

          • All religion is man-made.

          • The entirety of the Christian belief system is “my god is better than your god”.
            In fact, in many cases, Christianity goes as far as stating other gods simply do not exist.
            Every flavor of Christianity was the “new and improved version” at one point in time.
            I am an agnostic. The more suffering I see, the more I am pushed towards atheism.
            The vengeful God of the Old Testament would create earthquakes. The loving Jesus would prevent them.
            One is either more powerful than the other — or both simply do not exist.

          • AKlady,
            Well, we have been down that road. Jesus did exist. As I recall, there was an earthquake when He died. Earthquakes have been a fairly common occurrence throughout the existence of the planet. God evoked a whole series of nasty happenings during His exercise in the freeing of the Israelites from Egypt. But those had occurred many times before that and have since.

          • The vengeful God of the Old Testament would create earthquakes.

            The loving Jesus would prevent them.

            One is either more powerful than the other — or both simply do not exist.

          • @AKLady, AS I SAID IT IS YOUR CHOICE!

          • @aklADY, that’s THE GOODNESS OF God, He gives us a Choice. So in the End you have chose your own destiny.

          • Some choice??? What a joke!! Either I believe in your god or I’m condemned to burn in hell for all of eternity. The only person that controls my destiny is ME!! I won’t waste my time believing in some false god that controls my life & watches everything I do. You Christians are nothing but slaves to an invisible being that doesn’t exist & never has. Time to take the blinders off & start living in the real world.

          • Just how many Gods are there? Just how many Gods will you be judged by? Since my God has the best way of living and has the highest of standards, I will opt with Him. You take the choices of the God you wish but remember in the end there will be an accounting. And I am not sitting in judgement of people, that is God’s job. BTW way it is not rude to want to prevent people from suffering. We have enough suffering already. But suffer as you wish and go ahead and promote more suffering.

          • The “my god” is better than “your god” game.

          • No game. And there is only one God. The rest are powerless as you will find out.

          • How many? Hundreds if not thousands.

          • You hae a god..He is Satin.

          • How do you “hae” a god?

          • So, AKLady hates satin, a smooth, glossy fabric ? LMAO!!!

          • Christian hate on display.
            Is it not beautiful?

          • But that’s what you are doing!!! And through DECEPTION and Guile–AKLady–you are the RUDE one!! And very SINFUL!!

          • Hate, bigotry, ignorance, threat….
            Behold the true Christian.

          • IS THERE A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN WARNING and imposing? You should select your words more carefully.

          • She is not imposing anything. It is up to each individual to make that decision. You just want to cause disruption, IMHO!

          • If a Christians belief in Jesus Christ as the propitiation for his sins and that is false, and your denial of Jesus Christ is true, the Christian believer has lost nothing. However, if the Christians belief in Jesus Christ as propitiation for sin is true, then your denial of Jesus Christ results in your loss of eternal life with God forever, Thus, the Christian believer has nothing to lose and those who do not believe may have eternal life to lose. Where will that soul go? One with God and one with Lucifer also known as Satan who was cast out of God’s domain for his disobedience.

          • How do you play that since there is only one God. Don’t mean to offend…

          • You are also playing that game. It is very rude and insulting.

            You are assuming that you have the right to demean the beliefs of others. You do not.

            Doing so is a very un-Christian behavior.

          • By making the statement you just made. There are many religions across this Earth, Some have multiple deities.
            Every time you whip out the “there is only one God” you are insulting billions of people.
            One should have respect for the religion of others; even though we do follow their belief systems.

          • You are assuming a position of absoluteness, that your position and only your position is the right one. I find that arrogant.

          • William,
            What Christians know is what they know. There is nothing arrogant about them. If you were born of the spirit you would also know.

          • And that is arrogance. But that is the arrogance of a religion that claims that it is right and all other religions are wrong. That is even more arrogant than Islam, because Muslims know and believe that Christians, Jews and Zoroastrianism will also be saved because they also worship the same god. Jews believe that any nonJew who lives and ethical and moral life will be saved. One need not to convert to Judaism. And as for other religions – they hold that every religion has something important to teach us or that what religion is right for you, is right for you. Thus, you can be Daoist and Buddhist at the same time. Or some of my relatives are both Shintoists, since they are Japanese, but also Buddhists.

          • Mogan,
            I am a Constitutional conservative who adheres to the Constitution literally. Do that make me arrogant about the Constitution? Hardly. I believe what I believe and that is that. I believe the earth is round. The astronauts who went to the moon took photos of the earth. Does that make me arrogant about science? Hardly. The earth is round. as the needle said to the nudist, sew what?

          • On that no. But traditionally the monotheistic religions are arrogant and are exclusive. They are the ones that claim they are right an all others are wrong. it is for that reason you can be a member of only one of them. The other religions are inclusive and pluralistic. But even between three monotheistic religions there are differences. As I mentioned before. Zoroastrianism is actually the oldest monotheistic religion, but it is dying out. Zoroastrianis do not allow converts. You have to be born into that religion; just as it is for many others. But, for Zoroastrians, it is not necessary to convert as long as you live a life of good words, thoughts and deeds.

          • Mogan,
            I have not dealt with the old religions since I was in college. I don’t remember much about them but they were not of any great interest to me.

          • i’m not sure what you mean by old religions. Do you mean the other major religions today: Buddhism, Daoism, Judaism, Hinduism, Confucianism, etc? They are not the old religions: that would various Greco Roman religions, the religions of the various peoples of Mesopotamia, Old Persian religion, Vedic religion, Israelite religion and thus various religious that we have from 3,000 b.c.e. up to say, 500 c.e. Then of course there is about 10,000 years of religions of which we have no written records since they existed before there was any written language.

          • Mogan,
            I was referring to the old European and Middle East religions. I do not even remember he names of them all. Some do date back to before written languages. Sun gods were popular.

          • For the major ancient religions, those of the various peoples of Mesopotamia, their origins are preliterate but they truly come into their own with the invention of written languages. But even then the literacy rate was low. Even during the Roman Empire problem about 10% of the population could read or write. Maybe a little higher, but not that much more.

          • LOL, So what your saying is that only those who could read or write, were able to build very Deep Caves and the Pyramids to scribble their language in them, 1,000’s of yrs. ago and all of the Stupid one’s sat back and watched.

          • I don’t know what in Sheol you are talking about. The Egyptian pyramids were created in the third and fourth dynasties, well after the Egyptians invented a written language for themselves. What deep caves? Be specific? But if you are talking about the literacy rate, yes it was small during the time of the Roman Empire. You can check that out for yourself – some scholars want to put it as high as 15%, but some, including myself it is between 7% and 15%.
            But if you are talking about edifices such as stonehenge or burial mounds, etc., they were done when there was no written language.

          • Ah, I think the Stupid Ones did the building and the literate ones sat back.
            In present times in the usa, the Stupid Ones sit back, and the Literate working class do the building!!!!!

          • The stupid ones did the hard labor.

          • No…The stupid ones ended up on the bottom of the Red Sea and Pharaoh lost his kingdom because he refused to adhere to the command of the Lord, given through Moses.

          • Just another made up story from that fictional book you call the word of god. Like I stated before , you Christians are so gullible& will believe anything, no matter what . It’s time to take the blinders off.

          • What biblical scholars now call the Reed ‘Sea’ event, probably did happen, but not the way people think of it today. The oldest account, from the late 10th or early 9th century b.c.ec. states that the East wind blew away the water, like marsh water or a tide. A century later another account has it that it was simply the clogging of the wheels of the Egyptian chariots. It is only about 500 years after the first account and 700 years after the actual event that we have the huge special effects version.

          • Actually not the Red Sea, Yam suph refers to any body of water that has papyrus reeds in it. So it could be marshland, which is along the tradition route to Mt. Sinai, but not the Red Sea;doesn’t even make sense.

          • You do know that many who built those monuments were enslaved people…………….

          • LOL, So why aren’t they blaming the Egyptians……..instead of only the White People! They were STUPID THEN AND STUPID NOW!

          • Was there even a shred of a coherent thought in that post?

          • Not coherent at all. Were you expecting that it would be?

          • They are what they are.

          • We now know that the workers on the pyramids and the mortuary cities of Egypt were not slaves but volunteers. They were the most well fed Egyptians, because the Egyptians had large cattle operations so that they would have plenty of red meat.

          • That was beginning of great artist. The hired to show pictures of the Bible. Some of greatest period for art.

          • Mogan,
            Thanks again for the info. As I just told Janet, I am a historian by education and practice. I did have a course in college on origin of languages. As such, I base what I write about on facts and not hearsay or oral tradition.

          • The world is not 10,000 years old .. around 6,000 or maybe a little more …
            If you can find the book titled ” the trail of blood ” by J. M. Carroll it has a Chart showing the first established faith …

          • Another science denier. So, I guess you deny the results of scientific research when it comes to biology, geology, physics, chemistry, etc.
            But it is the US, and everyone has the right to be uneducated.

          • Excellent.
            Wish I had thought of it.

          • You would have. About ten years ago I worked on a BBC documentary. BBC people told me that they were going to make two versions of the document, which was on Jesus. Anyway, one copy was for the UK while the other copy was for the US, and therefore had to be dumb downed That was because of people like Janet. I always find it interesting that if there is a conflict between science and religion, those who choose their religious beliefs over science are fundamentalist Christians and fundamentalist Muslims.

          • Fundamentalism has a very strong relationship to education, or should I say the lack thereof.

          • There is a connection, most fundamentalist Christians only have a high school education, unless they go to a fundamentalist Christian college. But, research has shown high school level only.

          • The U.S. Census says something far worse — “Red” states have the highest percentage of highschool dropouts.

          • The earth is over a million years old, you are an idiot.

          • How do you know it is! Did you GOOGLE IT!

          • Science-it a really great thing!

          • Truth be told, for those, who believe the King of kings, no explanation is necessary. For those, who refuse to believe, no explanation will do.
            This is repeatedly seen inside this forum.

          • So, when it comes to science it is all false?

          • Then how do explain all the dinosaur fossils that have been discovered & dated to be at least 60 millions years old or older, depending on which time period they came from ? Unless you agree with Ken Hamm, who claims that dinosaurs shared the earth with humans in the same time period. He even built a creationist museum in Kentucky, complete with dinosaurs living side by side with humans. Ken Hamm is a lunatic& you’re an idiot.

          • Cheryl Lynn Smith-Bell

            The flood killed them off. They would not have had enough food for their huge size for years, till the earth regrew. The carbon dating does not take the water pressure of the flood into consideration, when they try to date fossils. They deny the Bible and they lose the truth. Every culture from ancient times had a flood story.

          • The flood killed them off ??? You Christians are hilarious. LOL!!!

          • I’m guessing that you don’t have a “science” backed education?

          • What would lead you to that conclusion ? Just being sarcastic. LOL!!

          • Got news for you, there was never a global flood. No proof of that whatsoever. By the way, the story of Noah is based on the story of Utnapishtim from Sumerian and Akkadian mythologies. Probably, what we have was a flood concerning the Black Sea alone.
            The Egyptians, by the way, don’t have a flood story because for the Egyptians – floods, that is the flooding of the Nile are not evil or bad.

          • Did Jesus ride a dinosaur?

          • Is that a dinosaur Jesus was riding? Silly me!! I could have sworn it was a donkey. LOL!!!

          • Today he would be driving a Hyundai.

          • Medical science gave up and sent me home to die — in June, 1971. Prayer kept me alive.
            The truth in the statement, above, is this: THE HOLY BIBLE. IT WORKS, WHETHER YOU BELIEVE IN IT OR NOT!

            Only those, made righteous by the blood of the Lamb of God, Who takes away the sins of the earth, realize that, though!

          • So all of the sciences are wrong. Biology is a lie; geology is a lie; physics is a lie, astronomy is a lie, chemistry is a lie. By the way with the diagnostic tools that we have today, you might not have been sent home now in 2015.
            If you break a bone; don’t go to a doctor, go to your minister to fix it.

          • Sarcasm aside, it is possible to have a minister heal something that a medical doctor cannot (or has given up on attempting to) heal.

            Medical science is limited. God is not.

            We do have a God of love, who allows us to have medical doctors to help, because our faith is so small that we don’t know how to approach the Throne of Grace, in order to receive the healing we need.

            Another thing…This is the last time I will reply to an immature, sarcastic post. If you want a reply from me, keep your posts on the mature side.

          • LOL. The Earth’s age is in the billions, not the thousands.

          • In no way, shape or form, can you prove that!! Every method, used by scientists, to prove the age of something, will give you a different result.
            Only (make that ONLY) the Christ, Who spoke the world into being, can tell you how old this place is.

          • Man did not walk with the dinosaurs. Period, end of discussion.

          • Nope!
            This discussion continues because you have no way to prove what you have just said.

          • Most of those are not religions. Most are considered philosophies.

          • Not really. No two religions are alike and there is no universal characteristic found in all religions. Some eastern religions appear more like religious philosophies.

          • then you can not very well debate about what you do not know understand ,and no wonder it is because they held no interest to you .. I’m thinking if you started reading you would have interest and a change of heart… try reading first John 1:1-14 .. read Romans then Genesis then Psalms I read in the Levitt Letter 2008 that Scholarly Jews Rethinking the Resurrection the article is by Professor Israel Knohl
            Morgan, there are many Jews now reading the New Testament …

          • There has been a history of important New Testament scholars, but they remained devout Jews. Amy-Jill Levine of Vanderbilt is one of them. As for Knohl, I don’t buy into his theory of a belief in a suffering messiah prior to the first century of our era. His arguments to me are not that convincing. However, there was in early Rabbinic literature mentions of the coming of two Messiahs, which is what you have in the Dead Sea Scrolls. There is also an object of interest presently – a wall inscription that is called the “Gabriel Inscription,’ which talks about the coming of two messiahs, the first from the tribe of Ephraim and the second of the tribe of Judah. We don’t know where the inscription originated, it was found in a collection of a private owner. The writing style is similar to what we find in the Dead Sea Scrolls. There has been issues over the translation because there are gaps. Some have seen references of how the Messiah of Ephraim will die but Gabriel will raise him up. But now scholars see that the early translators of this inscription were reading too much into the texts when they were filling in the ‘gaps’ to make a coherent translation.
            But, if this is true of a dying and rising Messiah belief prior to Jesus, then it could mean that Jesus saw himself as being that Messiah. That would explain why he tells his disciples of the coming cosmic judge, the Son of Man whom they will eventually follows. Jesus himself never claimed that he was a descendant of David.
            That view, I don’t quite by, because when followers of Jesus first proclaimed him as the Messiah, they believed that Jesus became the Messiah at his death and resurrection. – That is what you find in Romans 1.3-4 (an early Aramaic confession) and the hymn Paul quotes in Philippians 2, although that hymn came from a Christian composer who was originally a pagan.

          • @Morgan, the Messiah you speak of is the man that will claim to be the Messiah and will perform so call miracles’ and the people will be deceived by him, which is the Antichrist from Satan. Many will be deceived, even some of the Christians will be deceived. That’s why the Bible says try the spirit by the spirit and you shall know who they are, and beware of false prophecies. Know God for yourself and stand on his word so that you shall stand in the days of trouble.

          • Nope. I take it you are referring to the figure of the AntiChrist in the Apocalypse of John (Book of Revelations). I am not talking about him. The original concept of the Messiah came out of the middle second century b.c.e. in the Psalms of Solomon, and there you read that the Messiah will be a military leader who will destroy or drive out of Israel all evildoers, i.e., most nonJews. and he will re-establish the kingdom of David and Solomon.
            But other Jewish authors had a different concept – that is the Messiah is a spiritual being who looks whom, but who existed before the creation of the constellations. When he comes he will destroy all of the wicked, primarily nonJews, and then with restore Jerusalem and its temple. That is what we have in 1 Enoch.
            But then with the authors of the Dead Sea Scrolls but also other Jews, there was a belief in the coming of two messiahs one from the tribe of Judah (Davidic or Princely Messiah) and from Levi (the Priestly Messah). As to their actual functions, not that clear.
            Then, evidently, with the Gabriel Inscription, you have a variation on the belief of two messiahs. Then of course, many Jews in antiquity didn’t believe in the coming of the Messiah or two Messiahs, some believed that Moses would return, or Elijah, or even Jeremiah. And, many Jews didn’t believe in a Messiah at all.
            Not getting back to the Anti-Christ and the Beast in Revelations – although much of what is associated with him is connected to Nero, the Beast is the Emperor Domitian, who ordered that all Romans make a form loyalty to oath and for the men who made the oath, a special stripe would be placed on their togas. Moreover, Domitian took very seriously the emperor’s cult.
            Now through the passage of time,the Beast was identified as the Kaiser, during WWI, Hitler during WWII, and Stalin during the Cold War. Keeps on changing because the author of the Apocalypse of John had a vision that Jesus would destroy the Roman Empire with a heavenly army. Since, that never happened, the book gets constantly reinterpreted to fit the present times, which is why you have some writing about how Obama is the Beast and the AntiChrist. But in a few years, someone will claim it is all about Hillary, or whoever is the next Democrat as President.

          • @Mogan, you are right. It does comes from Revelation.

          • Excellent.

          • Cheryl Lynn Smith-Bell

            Go to Revelation, The Bride, The Beast, and Babylon on utube. An Amazing Facts presentation, will help you understand the times we’re in.

          • It has nothing to do with today. Part of the book were written when Nero was emperor but it was finished in the time of Vespasian. The beast is Vespasian; Babylon is Rome, since both destroyed Jerusalem and the temple. the Bridge is the church.

          • R u sure???

          • Janet,
            I have digested the Bible for well over half a century. It is based on someone who actually lived on the earth and said what He said.
            I was making reference to the old sun gods an other such Middle East/Greek gods not based on an actual person such as Jesus.
            Apparently you misunderstood what I was saying about “old” gods

          • You need to Google. Sciene vs the Bible and the proof can also be found in the 330 prophecies which speak of the birth, life, death and resurrection of Jesus.

          • Only for Christians and most of those are not prophecies. In fact, Christians have a history of reinterpreting actual prophecies so that they deal with Jesus, when they actually do not. According to Judaism, there is no prophecy of a messiah any where in the Jewish Bible (Christian Old Testaments).

          • Then why do Jews always say they are waiting for the Messiah to come? Read Isaiah 53.

          • morgan is a jerk, leave him alone.

          • Why would I leave morgan alone? I AGREE WITH EVERY WORD, COMING FROM THOSE POSTS!

          • Then you are not reading closely some of the ridiculous comments he makes.

          • It’s actually what you learn in Christian seminaries, that are not fundamentalist.

          • I have been looking back over some of the posts he has made in this series of comments. He is either a nut or a member of some strange cult. Jehovah’s Witness???

          • Most Jews don’t believe in the Messiah. Orthodox and some Conservative Jews do. But, Isaiah 53 has nothing to do with the Messiah. Judaism long recognized that the belief in the Messiah is nonbiblical. Isaiah 53 is about the Judah, the country, as the suffering servant, by the way.
            Judaism doesn’t recognize anything in the Jewish Bible (What you have in Christian Old Testaments {there is more than one in Christianity}. The concept of the Messiah came out of the second century b.c.e. Now, Christianity has taken passages of Jewish scripture and reinterpreted them about Jesus, and in so doing they changed the purpose of the coming of the Messiah.
            But getting back to Judaism, it is not a universal belief in Judaism but never was. And, the concept of the Messiah is different, as well, for those who do.

          • Cheryl Lynn Smith-Bell

            They refused to acknowledge that Jesus was THE messiah. The tora is full of the prophecies predicting Jesus’s coming.
            They were responsible for his death, and they refuse to take responsibility for that, so they deny that He in fact came and fulfilled the prophecies.

          • The Torah is not filled with any prophecies of the Messiah. Christians take passages from the Torah and the rest of the Hebrew Bible and take them out of context. Now, as for the Jews and the death of Jesus – Jesus was executed by Rome as an enemy of the Roman state. Crucifixion is reserved for runaway slaves, thieves and the political enemies of Rome. Jesus would have fit only the last category.
            Jews then and now refuse to accept Jesus as the Messiah for he didn’t do anything that the Messiah was to do.
            Where is the universal resurrection of the dead?
            Where is the final judgment?
            Where is the kingdom of God?
            Why is there still evil and why are there so many sinners around, and that includes most gentiles?
            For Judaism, the Messiah is not to die for the sins of the world but to slay those who are the sinners.
            Nor is the Messiah a biological son of God, but one chosen by God.
            Now, all of this is why there is a belief in Christianity of the second coming of Jesus because he didn’t do what he was supposed to do, if he was the Messiah.
            In Judaism, the Messiah will do the job the first time.

          • Cheryl Lynn Smith-Bell

            That’s why God let them be and took the gospel to the gentiles. Total wrong headedness.

          • Your following Paul’s train of thought in his letter to the Roman communities. However, Paul believed that all of his fellow Jews would be saved since God promised them salvation, actually already gave them salvation since they are God’s people. Oh 1844 – so you are a Seventh Day Adventist. Interesting position from the 19th century.

          • That’s a simple question to answer, mjhiggs, They have never accept the Lord Jesus Christ as the Messiah. I have had a Jewish friend, whom I met, when she began teaching (I was a student in the school but not in her class) and she told me this.

            The only thing is this, it’s becoming closer and closer to the time, when their Messiah will return to destroy Israel’s enemies, who are already making plans to destroy God’s chosen people and take the Promised Land from them.
            When that happens and the Lord destroys Israel’s enemies, they will be shocked to see that the One, Who has saved them is the One, Whom they have rejected.

            Not only that, those, like some – herein – will stand before Him and be judged guilty of rejecting the Gift, given for their salvation, and remember how they had been told, numerous times, that He is the Way, the Truth and the Life.
            Unfortunately, some – right here – may be amongst those.

          • I was asking the question to “Morgan” who posted directly above mine. He said, “…there is no prophecy of a messiah any where in the Jewish Bible (Christian Old Testaments.)” That statement is simply not true because there are many references to a coming Messiah in the Old Testament. And though the Jews largely rejected Jesus as their Messiah, they still say they are awaiting the coming of the Messiah. (But we know He already came 2000 years ago! There will be weeping for a week in Israel when the Jews realize it was Jesus who was their Messiah whom they crucified.)

          • In reply to your question – sorry didn’t see it until now. All of the books in the Hebrew Bible were written before the concept of Messiah was invented in the middle of the second century b.c.e. Now, early Christians tried to look in Jewish Scripture to prove that Jesus was the Messiah, and made use of passages that are not about the Messiah at all, but they applied them to Jesus.

            One example: Isaiah 7.14 has nothing to do about the Messiah or Jesus. To understand that verse you have to read the entire chapter. We are dealing with King Ahaz of Judah and he is being attacked by two countries: Syria, rulled by Rezin and Israel (the Northern Kingdom) by Pekah. Rezin and Pekah want Ahaz to join them in a coalition to fight off the Assyrians. Ahaz refuses and thus we have the Syro-Ephraimite War. Isaiah’s advice to Ahaz is not to do anything and that Yahweh, the God of Israel, will take are of it. Ahaz is just too afraid. If he joins the coalition the Assyrians will defeat them and he will end up dead. If doesn’t, Rezin and Pekah will kill him and replace him with a king that will agree with them.

            Isaiah says that Yahweh has a sign for him: 7:14 Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign. Look, the young woman is with child and shall bear a son, and shall name him Immanuel. 7:15 He shall eat curds and honey by the time he knows how to refuse the evil and choose the good. 7:16 For before the child knows how to refuse the evil and choose the good, the land before whose two kings you are in dread will be deserted.

            Pay close attention: the woman is already pregnant and about to give birth. By the time knows the difference between right and wrong, the two kings, that is Rezin and Pekah will no longer be a problem. Now, who the woman is, that we don’t know. Could be Ahaz’s wife and she is pregnant with Hezekiah or perhaps Isaiah’s wife is pregnant with a child we don’t even know of.
            Now, how is the birth of Jesus, centuries later be sign for a war that is taking place now, in the time of Ahaz and Isaiah?
            Now this verse, out of context and in Greek, not Hebrews is used by the authors of Matthew to introduce the concept of Jesus;’ virgin birth. In the Hebrew, the word ‘almah’ refers to a young woman. not bethulah, which means virgin. But even the Greek word that is found in the Greek translation of Isaiah 7.14, parthenos, does mean virgin, but its primary meaning is also a woman who is about to give birth for the first time. But then the Matthean authors change the words so that it is the people who will call him Immanuel, whereas in Isaiah, it is the woman who will name him Immanuel. This change had to be done because Jesus was name Jesus, not Immanuel. As for the name Immanuel, it is most likely a title for the king of Judah.
            But again, how can the birth of Jesus have any affect on a war that occurred in the 8th century b.c.e? And, of course, with all of these so called prophecies, why aren’t they ever straightforward? The prophets are able to do that with every one of their actual prophecies.

          • Actually, most Jews don’t believe in the coming of the Messiah on the grounds that it is a post biblical belief. The Orthodox do; some Conservatives do, but Reform Judaism rejects the concept of Messiah. If there is a Messiah, it won’t be Jesus.

          • More religious propaganda- The spreading of ideas or information to further or damage a cause.

          • the OT points to the NT of the coming of the Savior and His death …. Christians did not rewrite the OT or the NT they are as written and they are true ,the Dead Sea Scrolls affirm .

          • BUT, these are stories written by common men, passed on by word of mouth. Have you ever played the telephone game? (whisper a message to one person, they tell it to another. On & on, until it gets back to original person. 1/2 the time the message is SO different, it’s hard to believe). Then it continued to be passed on by word of mouth & then translated years later into print. And how many times has it been translated? It’s not perfect. In fact, Matthew, Mark, Luke, & John were writing about the same incidents. Look at the variety.

          • Cheryl Lynn Smith-Bell

            No, they are not. They are inspired writings written by the very men who were there[the gospels]. They were copied exactly With not one jot or title changed, by scribes hidden away in caves. The dead sea scrolls say exactly what our bibles do. You should do a little research before you spout off things you know nothing about. Every one who witnesses an accident, does so from there own perspective. Why would you think four separate men would report the same thing exactly alike?

          • First, when it comes to the authors the gospels, none of them were one of the 12 disciples. They don’t claim that, and there is no proof that they were. For the authors of Matthew and Luke, out of 661 verses in Mark, they used all of them except for 61 verses and did so verbatim. For the authors of Matthew and the author of Luke they used both the Gospel of Mark and then oral and written sources in creating their biographies of Jesus. The author of Luke claims he has read everything else and his biography of Jesus, which also had a second volume, Acts, is better than anything else.
            The tradition that the Gospel of Mark is the Gospel of Mark comes from the mid second century.
            When it comes to the Gospel of John, 95% is not found in any Christian literature in and outside of the New Testament, and its presentation of Jesus is radically different form what we have in Mark, Matthew and Luke.

          • That’s right…Let’s not forget, however, that Saul wasn’t there. He met the One he persecuted and was blinded. When the scales fell from his eyes, he served that One until his dying day.

            That reminds me of something one of my Bible college professors said: “WHY DIE FOR A LIE?!?:”
            Every one of Christ’s disciples, who didn’t die, prior to His own death, were martyred (except John, who lived and was exiled to Patmos, where he wrote the Book of the Revelation** and lived until his own death.

            Every one of those will be with Him, when He comes to deliver Israel from total annihilation, too! It will be much worse, for those, who take the Mark of the Beast, just for a meal, etc., than for those, who knew Him and are with Him, when the time comes.

            ** The thing about the truth of the Book of the Revelation is in the fact that the things, written, therein, are coming to pass now! He wrote of a beast, which includes all the countries, already seen in the Book of Daniel — except the Eagle (America) isn’t there…it may mean that America won’t be around, much longer…with the way America’s leadership has turned its back on Israel, I wouldn’t be surprised to wake up and find China has expanded her land from the west side of the Pacific Ocean and taken over the land, where trillions of dollars are now owed to the Chinese.

          • Oops, but he didn’t write the Apocalypse of John. The author doesn’t claim to have been one of the twelve. He clearly identifies himself as a Christian prophet. Most people don’t know that in early Christianity there were prophets, through whom Jesus spoke.
            Now when it comes to the Apocalypse of John, written around 95, it is about the Roman Empire, the whore of Babylon, and the Beast being the emperor Vespasian.
            As for the Book of Daniel, it is all about Antiochus IV, the ruler of the Seleucid empire who had banned the practice of Judaism, slaughtered a pig on the altar of the Jerusalem Temple and erected a statue of Zeus Olympus, proclaiming that all of his subjects bow down to him. The Book of Daniel was written just prior to the Maccabean revolt.
            There is a long history of reinterpreting both of these books through the centuries, to make them pertinent from one generation to another. But the authors of both words are dealing with a particular situation in their time, and their time only.

          • Nope. As I have said elsewhere, Christians take Jewish scripture out of context to prove that Jesus is the Messiah. Those passages in scripture have nothing to do with the Messiah. The concept of the coming of a Messiah didn’t appear into the second century b.c.e.

          • Cheryl Lynn Smith-Bell

            Jews who do not believe in Christ, and Him risen, are not Christian.

          • Of course not. Because Jesus didn’t do anything that the Messiah was supposed to do. Then, again for some Jews, Christianity is a false religion because it abuses Jewish scripture and has a long history of persecuting Jews.

          • That is correct. However, in 1975, a Jewish lady told me she, like all her Jewish brethren, didn’t believe in heaven or hell. When I found her again, in about 1999, she told me she’d begun to step away from those beliefs.
            My point is that the Lord is bringing His own to Himself, allowing them to see the error they were raised in.

            Too bad that many, in the forum, don’t have the sense to do the same.

          • People can change their minds. If you are an Orthodox Jew who will believe in Gehenna (not quite the Christian concept of Hell), and Gan Eden (heaven), along with resurrection from the dead and a final judgement, that will lead to the coming of the Kingdom of God here on earth. But none of this is required beliefs in Judaism. All that you need to believe is that there is one God, one God alone. Judaism has always recognized in times of persecution and war, a belief in a life after death offers comfort to families, but there is no proof that there is a life after death. And for Reform and Conservative Jews, it is a matter of personal preference to believe in an afterlife, but on the whole Reform Judaism rejects resurrection from the dead, and afterlife because they cannot be scientifically proven. And, by the way, Judaism rejects the existence of Satan because it is post biblical belief. Satan the profession bad guy, is not to be found in the Hebrew Bible. Instead, Satan, who really only appears or is mentioned in Zechariah and Job, is a member of the council of the sons of god, kind of a prosecuting attorney. Cynical – yes. Evil-not. It is only later on in Jewish writings that never made it into the Bible that you Satan or Satanail being presented as a fallen angel either because of pride or for refusing to bow down to Adam.

          • You’re right. The desire to change one’s mind and the act of repentance are the only things that will allow lowly humans into the Kingdom of God.

          • You are correct from your perspective. Nothing wrong with that.

          • Just a question. I am just curious – when you think of Christianity or have an image of Christian – what do you have in mind?
            I know that many fundamentalist Christians think of Roman Catholicism as a cult, but what about the Orthodox Christians – Greek Orthodox, etc. What do you think of them?
            Just curious. There are over 2,000 Christian denominations, most of which is here in the US, so which denominations do you consider real forms of Christianity and which ones are not?
            Again, I am just curious.

          • Cheryl Lynn Smith-Bell

            Then why was King Herod able to go to the pharasies and find In the prophecy where Jesus was to be born? Hmm?

          • He didn’t. What you have is a Christian writing that he did. When dealing with any the gospels in the New Testament, they are representative of different types of Greco-Roman biographies, but they are in no way objective history, but, and I mean this in the nicest way, religious propaganda. What I mean by that they are statements of faith. Each gospel represents the beliefs of different Christian communities. The authors of these gospels are dealing with specific problems within their community by writing their biographies. Gospel of Mark was created to deal with the issue of when did Jesus become the Messiah but also he is writing for a community that might be in Rome and is attempting to prove to nonChristians that Christians can be loyal to Rome. This was a touchy problem since Jesus was executed as an enemy of Rome. The Gospel of Matthew was created at the time of the birth of Rabbinic Judaism, and it wants to show that Jesus is the true interpreter of the Torah. Gospel of Luke is the one that follows the rules of historiography of the times, but the author Luke wants to present Jesus as the last of the prophets of Israel ad well as Messiah. But also he wants to present Jesus as a Greco-Roman itinerant teacher of a philosophy of ethics. These teachers were referred to as ‘divine men,’ because not only were they teachers, but miracle workers. Curiously enough the author of Luke doesn’t believe Jesus died for the sins of the world, but that his death was that of a righteous prophet.
            Finally, you have the Gospel of John, and this one was created for the members of Johannine Christianity only, which is why this gospel makes use of double meanings. Now, the Johannine Christians were heavily persecuted by their fellow Jews because they eventually came to believe that Jesus is more than the Messiah, but the preexistent Son who came to earth for a brief period of time. But then they further evolved by identifying Jesus as Yahweh the god of israel in the hymnic prologue.
            To be sure Johannine Christians believed that Jesus was human but at the same time a preexistent. Eventually most of the Johannine Christians came to believe that since Jesus is God, then he never had a human body. They say him not only as God the Son but also God the Father. That led to a conflict between Johannine Christians, which you can see in 1 John and 2 John, the authors of those two documents (or perhaps one author), combating these Johannine Christians concerning the importance of Jesus’ humanity as well as other problems between the two Johannine groups. Unfortunately, he lost the battle and the majority of Johannine Christians will eventually develop into various types of Christian Gnosticism.

          • Mogan: The correct statement is to suggest that non-Christians have a history of misinterpreting.

          • most atheists are brain dead, and he is one of them, talking through his butt.

          • I think most Christians are brain dead. That would explain why they believe in an invisible sky daddy, satan & the bible. Do you also believe in the easter bunny, the tooth fairy, santa claus, bigfoot, little green men from mars, dragons & so on…. It is you who is talking out of your ass.

          • Cheryl Lynn Smith-Bell

            One day God will reveal Himself to you, and the consequinses of not making the right choices, will one day dawn on you, and I hope it is not to late for you.

          • The threat.
            Sorry, that does not work very well with intelligent, educated individuals.

          • They are not brain dead. For most people who have a religion, it is to a degree of matter of where you were born. If you were born in the US, you have a 70% chance of being born into a Christian family and so, for the most part, you would become a Christian. Born in India, 95% of being born a Hindu, then a Jain, Sikh or Buddhist. To be sure with the exception of indigenous religions and Judaism, no one is actually born a Christian, etc., but geographical location pretty much determines that religion you end up with.
            But remember religion is all about faith, believing in something that can not be empirically proven.

          • Excellent. I agree 100%.
            If you need threat and reward to behave properly, you are incredibly immature.

          • Thank You.

          • It’s his right to be an atheist. Just as it’s your right to believe what you want to believe. But, if what you believe stops you from doing your job, chamge jobs!

          • Cheryl Lynn Smith-Bell

            Why should Christians bend to your evil intent?

          • I am a heterosexual Christian & have no evil
            intent. I just believe in treating everyone equally & following the law.

          • Reva, These days, man’s intents and laws have become so Godless, that it’s impossible to be a Christian and follow man’s laws.
            This statement is put into place, every time you see a Christian arrested for attempting to show a pregnant woman that her unborn child is a human and that the woman would be a murderer, should she abort that child.
            The law of the land allows them the murder the unborn baby. However, as was witnessed with Scott Peterson murdered his pregnant wife and then was convicted of two murders, the system is amiss because you can’t have it both ways.

            And, I’m sure that, should the murder mills — i.e. – Planned Parenthood, et al — see this, they will begin to attack courts, where murderers like Peterson are on trial because I’ve made a lot more sense, with my observation, than they have, with their demands.

          • You are right it is a double standard. Peterson should have been convicted just for the murder of his wife. But, a number of states will make the second homicide charge on the grounders that Peterson’s wife, wanted the fetus.
            But murder and abortion are not the same thing,now are they? You’ve got a problem with abortion, then convince all of us who believe that it is a matter just between the woman and her doctor, and family. Government should not interfere in the health and medical rights of the woman. Change the laws; make abortion first degree murder and then start executing the women, doctors and medical staff with first degree murder. You would also have include family members if they aided the woman, as well.
            Just don’t ban abortions after 20 weeks, have the state legislatures legislate for a first degree murder charge for abortion. Then, see how that works out.

          • Everyone should simply mind their own business.
            If you accept a job serving the public, that is exactly what you do — you serve the entire public.

            If that poses a religious conflict, you should not be stealing the job from someone who can actually perform all of the entailed duties.

            She lied and cheated to get the job.

          • Now, you’ve moved into the area of lies….Let’s look at the history of abortion: Normal McCorvey, who is now a believing Christian, lied about having been raped, in Dallas. TX, and those lies went all the way to the U.S. Supreme Court, leading to the murders of millions of unborn babies.
            ROE v WADE was based on a lie and, if you can find Ms. McCorvery, I’m sure you’ll find this information correct.
            DOE v BOLTON, which began when a Christian lady needed support for her children and south the assistance of what turned out to be a feminist attorney.

            That attorney took the case, all the way to the USSC, demanding that the woman hadn’t wanted the kids, to begin with — a boldfaced lie! — and it came out with Billy-Bob Clinton’s signature, legalizing what they call Partial Birth Abortion, meaning they baby’s head is outside the birth canal, when the doctor takes a sharp instrument and murders that baby.

            MURDER IS MURDER AND THOSE, WHO MURDER (and aren’t forgiven) WILL NEVER WALK THE STREETS OF GOLD!!

          • So, what. SCOTUS has determined that a woman has a constitutional right to an abortion. So change state laws so that it is first degree murder and then bring it to SCOTUS. You will have Scalia and Thomas already on your side.

          • Lies, piled higher and deeper. You may not violate the 1 Amendment rights of others. Period – end of argument.

          • Bend? No, simply don’t lie to obtain a job you know you cannot perform.

          • Mike G – Please go up and read what I just wrote to billdeserthills.

          • Whose the atheist?

          • only pagans are born into a religion of pagan cults
            Christians are born again of Christ Yeshua not into a religion or Christian Denomination ..
            God of the Bible is right His Word is true.
            I am a Christian I repented and believed on the Lord Yeshua and received Him as my Savior and Lord … and I could no more get to Heaven today than I could before 1985 … that is not based on my merits if I could then I could have before but I couldn’t there is but one way and Yeshua is the way Christians do not do good works to get saved or stay saved they do because we are saved…..

          • What a bunch of BS, can I sell you the Brooklyn Bridge it’s only 2 yrs., old. It’s been rebuilt. You’re all brainwashed, the biggest scam that has ever been pulled. None of you have any proof, you just go by what people say. Where are these people and why don’t they show themselves? Let’s hear the BS excuses now. They hiding behind Venus?

          • And you CAN’T PROVE THERE ISN’T A GOD! Try Googling that!

          • Can’t prove a negative. You can’t prove that there aren’t gods, either.

          • God said in ISAIAH Besides Me there is no other god I am the Savior ,the Holy One of Israel

          • So? We are dealing here with Deutero-Isaiah who is our first known Jew – our first monotheistic rather than henotheism. Judaism proclaims that there is one god, one god only and that is the god of Israel.
            But then we have God speaking through Zarathustra that is Ahura Mazda, the only god.
            You have the claim of one religion and then there are the claims of other religions whether a god, gods, cosmic force, universal soul, or for some religions – yes there are gods but they are of no importance.
            Now, if you are Jew, Christian or Muslim, you all believe in the same god, even though each religion has a different take when it comes to being monotheistic.
            But that god is not the god of other people. No matter how you shout it here. Again, what is true for your is true for you. But what you believe, your beliefs as a Christian didn’t exist before Christianity. Some you could claim goes back to apocalyptic Jews in the two centuries before the common era. And the belief in the god of Israel goes back to the time of Moses in the 13th century b.c.e. but prior to the 13th century – no one knew of that god, except perhaps the Midianites.

          • Again, excellent.
            Knowledge is said to be power, if nothing else, it gives us power over ourselves.

          • Wrong again!
            The Lord God is not Allah, so Jesus Christ, Who defeated death, hell and the grave is the One, by Whom you will be saved.
            Allah, is one of those, by whom you will be lost through eternity.

          • Allah in Hebrew is Elohe, one of the names of the God of Israel. According to Islam, they are the same god. Allah means ‘the god.’ Now, you can deny it; that’s your right; that is, the right to be uninformed. Now, Islam recognizes Jesus as the Messiah and the virgin birth. However, according to Islam, Jesus didn’t die on the cross but what was taken up to heaven prior to the crucifixion. For Islam, no on can take on sins of others. You cannot take on the sins of your child, if, God forbid, your child dies before. One must be accountable for his or sins – unlike Christianity – where some one else does.
            This is one of the things that is different between Christianity and Islam..
            It is also one of the reasons and Judaism and Islam are more a like that Judaism and Christianity.

          • Janet Bosley: You and I know this for fact. I just hope the likes of Faye Hayes, Morgan, et al, who pretend their way is equal to the Way, provided by the Lord, will realize this before it is too late.

            The Day of Salvation is still upon us. It won’t be, much longer, though.

          • Great comment.

          • The difference, here, Morgan, is that gods will have their place in the Lake of Fire, just like the liar….Jesus said Satan is a liar and the father of lies.
            That is why, “Thou shalt have no other gods before Me,” is the first of the Ten Commandments.

            And, you may recall that the same courts that are giving “Freedom of Speech” rights to every idiot, out there, are demanding the the Ten Commandments be removed from courthouses.
            That is another place, where the God, Who has blesses America for nearly 239 years, is being bushed out the backdoor, as America becomes so Politically Correct that anything of spiritual value is just thrown out.

            The so-called “excellent comment,” applauded by the disciple of Satan (Faye Hayes) isn’t so perfect, when you look at how simple it is to see right through it.

            Looking at what Janet Bosley said is what I would demand is an Excellent comment, though.

          • And the Ten Commandment should be removed. You want the government to tell people that you should not worship any other god but the god of Christianity (I’m leaving the Jews out of this because they are not as crazy as Christians). So, the only true American has to be a Christian American. The whole point of Freedom of Speech is for every idiot to speak his or her own mind without government retaliation. That includes idiots like you.
            Now, evidently you don’t believe in Freedom of Speech and Freedom of Religion – not very American of you.

          • You are an arrogant, pompous, holier than thou Christian so full of himself, it’s nauseating. Just because I don’t believe in your false god, that makes me a disciple of satan ? FYI, Atheists don’t believe in satan, so how can I be a disciple for someone I don’t even believe exist, just like I don’t believe in your false god, heaven & hell or that ancient book you refer to as the word of god ? I think you have your head screwed on backwards.

          • And YOU CAN’T PROVE THERE IS A god! Try Googling that!! IDIOT!!!

          • you are a keyboard Hero! You wouldn’t have the gut’s to tell me that Twice to my face! I’d bet the Farm on that one!

          • Religion IS a total scam. These people you’re referring to that most Christians get their info from, are in actuality, hiding behind Jupiter. LOL!!!

          • WRONG AGAIN!!
            I get my information from the Word of God…He has told me so much about why people, like you, hate Christians. I knew it was coming, before I was out of high school…36 years ago.
            How? You might ask. John 15:8 is where Christ was recorded to warn His people that the world, who would hate us, hated Him, first.

            You cannot, however, hide the fact that what He foresaw is happening, in the world, now. You’ve got earthquakes coming at a frequency that nobody ever dreamed of…even in the area, where I live, where no faults are anywhere around, we’ve had earthquakes, registering on the Richter Scale.
            You have more and more people walking away from righteousness (the Lord predicted a great falling away, in the latter days and it’s been ongoing for nearly 30 or more years, now).

            You wouldn’t begin to understand, because your head is stuck in the unrighteous sand of the world. Nor do I assume you can suggest an explanation as to why so many countries (unfortunately, this also includes the U.S., it seems) are lining up to see Israel destroyed.
            The unbeliever, worldwide, will have a front row seat, when He returns and destroys Israel’s enemies, who are attempting to destroy Israel.

            When I first read the Scripture, predicting “every eye will behold Him,” I wondered how this could be. I wondered how people on the side of the earth, away from where He appears, would be able to see Him.
            Then, CNN, FNN and all the other cable stations came into behing and that will make it possible for every eye to see Him, when He returns.

          • When it comes to Israel, we are still its greatest ally, even though we don’t quite agree with Netanyahu, and that also includes members of his own cabinet and a lot of Israelis.
            But you also should remember that when Jesus does return, many Christians believe that Jesus will destroy all of the Jews as well as other nonChristians.
            In fact, a friend of my gave me an old computer game that was created by those who created the Left Behind Books. The game is a first person shooter, in which you shoot and kill Jews.

          • Religion is not a scam. Religions deal with those things that are nonmanipulable – those events and crises in our lives that we cannot solve and must face. Religions tell us that we are important when it comes to the universe, and that there is a meaning and purpose in life and creation. Most religions also deal with the problem of evil and most offer a solution to that problem along with the greatest evil – death. Not all religions, because many speak of suffering rather than evil and not all offer a solution to the problem of death.

          • So Judaism is a pagan cult? To be sure you are not born a Christian or a Muslim. However, if you were born in India, you would most likely be a Hindu? In Saudi Arabia, a Muslim. In the US, 70% you will be a Christian. What your religion is, is more often than not an accident of birth. However, for Judaism – you are born a Jew; you might not later choose another religion than Judaism, so that might make you an ethnic Jew, but when it comes to religion you are, depending on which one you choose, a Christian, Buddhist, etc.

          • @Morgan, there are many and plenty churches. There are many and plenty religions, But God says there is One Church and that is his Church. The Lord thy God says the first thing he shall return for is his Church, not the buildings, not the names, but the Christians, the people that makes his church and every body that is in the church will not be saved. It will be The True Believers.

          • But that God is the god of your religion. Doesn’t really apply to those of us who are Jews, Buddhists, Hindus, Jains, etc. Again that is right for you to be believe, but that belief is only true within Christianity.

          • Morgan, Every nation was founded on a belief system ,, true you have it right there are nations founded on the religion of Hindu , Buddhism etc.. but Jews and Christians worship the same God of the Bible the God of Abraham, Isaac , Jacob ( Israel ) Joseph .. The difference is that some nations do not give the people a choice muslims do not let the people decide if they want to be muslim and the same is of other nations when one is born they are born in some countries they are born into its founding religion having no choice… However America was founded on the Bible the laws of God though everyone is to adhere to the law (‘s) ,they are not forced to be a Christian of any one Christian denomination ,but they do either obey the founding laws or go to jail just because one is not a Christian does not give them a green lite to lie, steal, rape or kill . Now America first thirteen Colonies were founded by Christians and each was founded on different Christians sects (denominations) Only Christians were qualified to hold an office ,but to hold an office in the thirteen one had to be of that Colony’s founded Christian sect….fact is I think 7 of 13 Colonies were state funded … The First Amendment was written to keep government from choosing one of the Christian denomination over all the others as America’s founded Christian denomination … also anyone of any Christian denomination could hold an office in any Colony regardless of their Christian Denomination they were no longer questioned(tested ) as to what Christian denomination they were .. Jews are not pagan they worship God .. No one is born a Christian being born in a Christian founded nation does not make one a Christian and I never implied such , I am saying that America was founded on the Bible and the laws of America are Biblical because they are moral
            The Bible and Government http://www.faithfacts.org/christ-and-the-culture/the-bible-and-government

          • Our nation was founded on Religious Freedom.

            First Amendment – Religion and Expression. Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

          • This nation was not founded on the Bible and God. Just look at the beginning of the Declaration “We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.” The truths are self evident – the truths come from rational and logical minds – not divine revelation. As for the “Creator” notice that you don’t have here God or Jesus or any mention of the Bible. Jefferson was careful about this – the Creator is the creator god of the Deists, a movement within the Enlightenment movement. For many of our founding fathers, they were Christian in name only, but Deists: Franklin, Jefferson and even Washington. They believed that the world was created by a god, but not the god of any known religion. But a god that is completely unknowable.

            Second, Thomas Paine, who is credited as the literary genius that led us to the American Revolution. It was he who coined the phrase declaration for independence. For that just read his tombstone. Paine was a Deist, who believed that Christianity is a sham.

            John Adams: “When philosophic reason is clear and certain by intuition or necessary induction, no subsequent revelation supported by prophecies or miracles can supersede it.” Also, “The United States of America have exhibited, perhaps, the first example of governments erected on the simple principles of nature; and if men are now sufficiently enlightened to disabuse themselves of artifice, imposture, hypocrisy, and superstition, they will consider this event as an era in their history. Although the detail of the formation of the American governments is at present little known or regarded either in Europe or in America, it may hereafter become an object of curiosity. It will never be pretended that any persons employed in that service had interviews with the gods, or were in any degree under the influence of Heaven, more than those at work upon ships or houses, or laboring in merchandise or agriculture; it will forever be acknowledged that these governments were contrived merely by the use of reason and the senses.”

            Not Christian principles – but what would be those Christian principles?
            Democracy – Ancient Athens
            All men are created equal – Deist not Christian
            Rugged individualism – that comes from corporations from the 1950s and their shills.
            Capitalism – not Christian in origin and not until the 16th century with Calvinism.
            So, what Christian principles?
            By the way, when the Jewish citizens of the colonies read the Declaration, they thought it was a purely Jewish document.

          • More excellence.
            You have more patience than I do.

          • That’s because if these really smart people objectively read History, their comments would be ” we are a “Judaeo-Christian” nation. Truth be known, the majority of our founders were christian, but they were also very close to the history of Europe and saw the atrocities that took place in the name of god such as the crusades & the inquisitions.

            The also saw the pissing match between the King of England and the Pope of that time and decided theirs would be a nation where religion and government had a clear separation.

            I believe that Amendment One in pretty specific in it’s intentions, but those on this site will make a weak rationalization as to why my post would be incorrect.

          • Yes, but also remember that many leaders of the Enlightenment were also imprisoned and some executed..
            Religious freedom was not really a reason for the existence of the colonies, with the exception of Maryland,which was originally set up to welcome Catholics, but then Protestants took over and started persecuting the Catholics. Before that with the Puritans they only wanted freedom of religion for themselves alone. Thus we get Rhode Island
            I would say that the country was set up as a secular nation with the majority being Christian. But to be honest, there are no Judeo-Christian values because Judaism and Christianity don’t share the same ethics and morality.
            I had some one replying that those who disagree with him on the history of this nation ought to get out and leave.

          • Morgan,

            I agree with you that religious freedom was not the primary agenda for the colonization of the new world. Many who came here did see that as their primary purpose, but the drive was for world domination and economic gain as that has always driven much of history.

            I disagree with you on the foundation of Judaeo-Christian influence of the old testament for foundation of the new testament, but that’s a whole different discussion. I do believe that one of the motives of the First Amendment was not only to separate church and state to protect government from religious domination, but to protect religion from government influence as well.

          • That’s true but also freedom from religion as well. The founding fathers were very much aware of the tyranny of organized religion.

          • There is no disagreement there.

          • What morals, by the way are exclusively Christian? The fact that the Bible was only book taught in school and then you had the McGuffey reader. So what, they didn’t have physics, biology textbooks.
            The whole idea of the US being a Christian nature came out from corporations who were fighting FDR’s New Deal – they hired Christian ministers to proclaim that this nation was a Christian nation and Christian virtues were capitalism, individualism. etc. They hired ministers such as Billy Graham to preach on these topics. It it why for example, England, Graham was called the corporate preacher.
            As for the first amendment, it was to protect us from religious tyranny, period.
            Now originally, the first amendment was interpreted as only applying at the federal level, which is why a number of states had religious requirements for public office and for elections. Some of those laws are still on the books, although they are never applied. It was why, for example, it was against the law to build a synagogue in Connecticut until 1849. By the way Scalia and Thomas hold the position that freedom of religion only applies at the federal level, and that the states can discriminate on basis of religion.
            As for other countries, you do have freedom of religion. More than those that have restrictions. Enough – written enough.

          • Morgan, If you ask me, “Freedom of Religion,” is tearing America asunder, now. You see, the forefathers knew nothing about what that word would come to mean; their goal was to prevent a leader from establishing a belief system, the way England had done.
            What it has come to is this, you’re allowed to bring in false gods; some of which weren’t even around, when America because the Land of the Free and, because they’re now demanding equal time and equal rights for the likes of Allah, et al.
            The difference remains: CHRIST’S TOMB IS EMPTY!!

          • What false gods? The founders were afraid of what is occurring now – a religious test for who can hold elective office, including the presidency. Those who claim that since we are a Christian nation then we must follow God’s laws. That’s Shari’ah. Also when you have conservatives claiming that freedom of religion only applies to Christians. It does apply to Jews, Buddhists, Muslims, etc. By talking about false gods, shows that you don’t believe in any kind of freedom of religion. But, that is understanding because Christianity is the most intolerant religion, even more so than Islam, but also Judaism, Hinduism, Buddhist, Daoism, Confucianism, and Jainism. Just to name a few.

          • Well said, Janet. Then, of course, you’re going experience belittling from the likes of Linda, who has no idea of the hell she is heading to.

          • Cheryl Lynn Smith-Bell

            The devil wants you to believe that. There is only one God the Father. People have many gods that they worship. Money would be one of them. Any thing you put before God becomes your idol/god. So to unbelievers, it makes no sense, because the spirit is not in you, the things of the spirit are a mystery. It is your own fault if you don’t believe. God will show Himself in thousands of ways, if you just ask.

          • Hasn’t really yet. But, what you say is true for you. But it is not true for anyone else. But, that is the thing about Christianity, it claims that it is the only true religion and all others, including Judaism, are false religions.

          • There are no “Living Gods”.

            You can prove anything to yourself that you set your mind to.

            If you find comfort in religion, fine. However do not force your beliefs on others.

          • Mogan: You keep mentioning monotheistic religions and, although Christianity isn’t a (quote) “religion” – and I can prove it – I’ll tell you this: Almighty God, the Maker of heaven and earth, is the One true God and, until you can prove any of the fake one, out there, have or can do what He has done, you can not sway me from believing that.

          • Your stance when it comes to Christianity is not a religion is what others say about their own. My (fill in the blank) is not a religion. What other people do religions. But, on the whole what you are saying about Christianity is ridiculous in light of the fact that take any Introduction to World Religions textbook and you will find Christianity along with the other religions. So, you can’t really prove it? While there are no universal characteristic found in all religions, when you do have enough you have a religion.
            Does Christianity have scripture? Yes
            Clergy? Yes
            Is there Christian ethics? Yes
            House of worship or meeting houses? Yes
            Worship serves (not true for all forms of Christianity, but true for majority)? Yes
            Systematic theologies? Yes
            Fellowship of believers? Yes

            Do we find the same thing with other ‘religions’ yes. Not all, but for the majority yes.
            Was Christianity created by human beings? Yes. There actually is not founder of Christianity. Jesus is not the founder of Christianity, but Christianity is about him. Jesus’ religion was apocalyptic form of Judaism, very similar to the Pharisees.
            Have Christians created doctrines, creeds and theological states? Yes
            Was it Christians that came up with churches, houses of worship? Yes
            Does Christianity teach a way of life in keeping with its beliefs as to who or what is God? Yes.
            Now, is Christianity is similar to other religions? No. Because no two religions are alike.
            Even with Judaism, Christianity is diametrically opposed to Judaism and vice versa, even though Christianity began as a Jewish sect.

          • Monotheistic is the way Christ is. He is Lord – PERIOD!
            He is the Way, the Truth and the Life…You will not make it into God’s holy heaven, in any other way!

          • For you, but for a good portion of the world’s population, no. Then again, for 99.9% of all the people who have have lived, they won’t enter either, since the bulk of them lived before Christianity ever existed.

          • It makes you arrogant about both.

          • AKLady,
            Did you miss seeing the photos of earth from space? It looked like it was supposed to look. Am I supposed to say that earth does not exist or that it is not round? You are not making much sense here.

          • Ignore AKLady she is here, only to cause disruption. She is a minion of the devil, IMHO. And she may be a he.

          • keepyhourpower,
            I engage in most anyone for the sake of discussion. I find that helpful to all those who post on these articles. As you no doubt know, I am not a hardliner on either side. I believe discussion serves to help all of us but I find just name calling in particularly bad taste and produces nothing of value. Many who disagree with me seem to respect that approach. In some cases, I do not deal with some issues just because they get of the topic of the article or get so complex that a response gets way too long. Many of mine get too long anyway.

          • You’re right, sorry Janet for calling you an idiot.

          • I think she is in bondage and searching for answers and hoping to get answers and the ones she is getting are not helping and for two reasons a lie is easier to believe because its what she has believed for years and the other is finding it hard to except the truth because it means she has to admit being wrong about the Lord ,about America’s Christian founding .. its like getting someone to jump in the water when you tell them its warm that she prays the Lord to show her truth although its all around her .. if she prays before reading the Bible God will open her eyes ..

          • got to throw the devil in when you can’t present a logical rebuttal.

          • Excellent.

          • She is (d)evil. IMHO!!!!!!!!! And as long as there is a 1st amendment, I will not be PC.

          • one can learn of America’s History by watching “Faith In History ” William Federer he also gives info on American Minute on FB

          • Talk about bad scholarship and historiography.

          • Janet,
            I am a historian by education and I do watch Federer.

          • I have studied both history and law. It did change my thought process significantly. Had you studied and practiced law, your thought process would also be greatly changed.

          • I’ll bet you don’t have any problems spending our money that Proudly Boasts IN GOD WE TRUST! lol…Trying going to WalMart with a pocket of rocks!

          • Which God?
            The one of the people who built the pyramids?
            The Eye of Horus?
            The Eye of Horus and the pyramids are both Egyptian– anything but Christian.
            Actually, in America it is termed “The Eye of Providence” and is associated with Freemasonry.

          • The Eye of Providence appears on many coats of arms and official seals, such as:

            Coat of arms of Braslaw, Belarus
            The Coat of Arms of Brasłaŭ, Belarus
            The Coat of Arms of Kalvarija, Lithuania
            The Coat of Arms and Flag of Plungė, Lithuania
            The Coat of Arms and Flag of Šiauliai, Lithuania
            Several college fraternities use the Eye of Providence in their coats of arms and/or badges, notably Delta Tau Delta, Phi Kappa Psi, Phi Delta Theta and Delta Kappa Epsilon
            The seal of the State of Colorado
            The seal of The University of Mississippi
            The seal of The University of Chile
            The seal of the city of Kenosha, Wisconsin.

          • AKLady,
            I am not an attorney. I am a historian. I can also see through liberal thinking. If you studied the history of the Constitution, then tell me more about it.

          • Yes, Jerry. You are a man. Men are always right.

            I have studied history. I did not come away with the same brainwashing that you did.

          • AKLady,
            So you came away with “different” brainwashing?
            Let me clarify a bit. Some of the leaders in the drawing up of the Constitution were deists. Some may have been Unitarians. But all of the colonies had representation in the Continental Congress, the drawing up of the Articles of Confederation in 1777 and the Constitutional Convention in Philadelphia from May 25 to Sept. 17. 1787. Certainly most of the representation were of varying Christian denominations. Every colony/state had to ratify the Constitution. They would not have done so had they had any theological disagreement with the document. No deist got any of their own personal beliefs into the Constitution.
            Deists believed in God but they used rationality to arrive at their conclusion. Therefore they were not atheists. Neither were Unitarians. The age of reason dies for a very logical reason – one man’s reason was another man’s anathema.

          • The primary author, Madison, was an agnostic.
            Agnostics are not atheists.

          • AKLady,
            The beliefs of the authors is irrelevant as the Constitutional Convention made the decisions and endorsed the final documents. Then the colonies had to ratify the document.

          • So what ever happened to the debate on the focus of the LBGT et al hatred towards Kim Davis? Seems like a battle between those who believe in God and those who don’t. Be patient, Kim we might return to the crux of this, but it may take a while.

          • Most people who are denied their constitutional rights do tend to get upset.

          • I agree. But would like to focus on Davis and her fight for her constitutional rights, not read a discussion on which religion. Since both sides of the religious argument are upset should I conclude that they have equally been denied their constitutional rights? I think so. The constitution does not recognize “a” religion but guarantees one’s freedom to choose any one of those he deems correct.

          • Sir,

            “The constitution does not recognize “a” religion but guarantees one’s freedom to choose any one of those he deems correct”.

            That was posted rather well.

          • The crux of the Davis matter is a discussion concerning separation of church and state.

          • Comme si, comme sa, at least in your opinion it’s all about that but, it could also be about her freedom under the constitution to be guaranteed that freedom. You might want to refresh your opinion by reading the comments much earlier in this discussion. You might also disagree since you have a locked in opinion of what is right and what is not right. I would point out that the earlier posts offer a most salient point of view. And not even SCOTUS can object to that.

          • There is no separation of Church, and State, and you know that.

          • There is a very clear separation between the two in America. It was very important to the Founders that the division should exist.

          • Wrong..read my statement about that.

          • Wrong..read my statement about that.

          • Listen child..go back to your building blocks…you do not have the IQ or EQ to understand….that goes for Bob666 and AKLady.

          • OK Uncle Fester,
            I guess those two Master’s Degrees in science and building one of the top 100 Civil engineering firms in the United States do not serve the fact that if I had a frontal lobotomy and a gallon of cheap hooch on a bad day, I could run circles around you.

            I would stick around and insult you, but I have a college course that I need to go and teach.
            https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/28fb56dbd1d6aa6e2df6cc297a182cbb71caa0c9b28a6b0274bc1a44ee160305.jpg

          • Not a troll..and obviously, I am more intelligent than you.

          • Well Uncle Fester,

            ” I am more intelligent than you”.

            Well Fester, You really do seem to have a comprehension problem if you really have read the First Amendment and I believe that you need to reevaluate that Troll claim.

            https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/7452232475077292ba6c670df982ef90e3b4b9df217a1a84e296d0a698caeb04.jpg

          • I’ve read it.
            History provides a factual opposition to your ideas.

          • Wrong! If you are speaking of Jefferson..he was not even there, when they wrote it. He was in France. Watch this..in the beginning, Mark Levin tells the truth, about the freedom of religion.

            http://bit.ly/1P2Zg7j

          • Sir,

            What part of the First Amendment do You not comprehend?

            First Amendment – Religion and Expression. “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof”; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

          • The forefathers were talking about not making one religion, the religion of the whole country. They left England because England decreed, that all Britons must be members of only ONE church. You need to research the 1st Amendment. There is no separation of church, and state. Do you know how many pictures, and carvings, and statues, there are of Moses, and the 10 Commandments, in the Supreme Court, the House and the Senate, and elsewhere.

            Are you aware that Jefferson spoke of how the House was used for church services, every Sunday? Do you know they prayed to God, and Jesus, before each session?

            You have a lot of research to do!

          • I have researched the First amendment and unlike you, with out bias or the need to support an agenda. You reference Jefferson hun?

            The same Jefferson that really was a deist? the Same Jefferson that edited the King James bible and rewrote it to his liking?

            Let’s look at some Jefferson Quotes:

            Say nothing of my religion. It is known to my god and myself alone.
            — Thomas Jefferson, in a letter to John Adams, 11 January 1817, in Lester Cappon, ed. The Adams-Jefferson Letters, (1959) p. 506, quoted from Jeremy Koselak

            I am of a sect by myself, as far as I know.
            — Thomas Jefferson, letter to Ezra Stiles Ely (June 25, 1819), quoted from Dickinson W Adams, ed, The Papers of Thomas Jefferson, Second Series (Princeton University Press, 1983; note that attributions saying “Ezra Stiles, president of Yale University (June 25, 1819)”

            All, too, will bear in mind this sacred principle, that though the will of the majority is in all cases to prevail, that will, to be rightful, must be reasonable; that the minority possess their equal rights, which equal laws must protect, and to violate which would be oppression.
            — Thomas Jefferson, First Inaugural Address, March 4, 1801

            And let us reflect that, having banished from our land that religious intolerance under which mankind so long bled and suffered, we have yet gained little if we countenance a political intolerance as despotic, as wicked, and capable of as bitter and bloody persecutions…. error of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it…. I deem the essential principles of our government…. Equal and exact justice to all men, of whatever state or persuasion, religious or political; …freedom of religion, freedom of the press, and freedom of person under the protection of the habeas corpus, and trial by juries impartially selected.

            https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/dcfda706ecb5a7cb70573dc6a8dd1177d3346908216fe830bad9c8cd94023161.jpg

          • Yes the earth is round, did they see God up there? What planet is he hiding behind, or why is he hiding, that’s what I want to know. They constantly see ufo’s and other strange things, could that be our God, or the God’s as they were originally called, and the heavens, then called heaven as a place? Your religions do not make any sense, don’t your realize that?

          • Great comment!! I’ve seen pictures of the earth & the moon, but not once have I ever seen god in any of those pictures. Why is that ? Religions make no sense, whatsoever!!

          • God has no face…he is every whwere

          • God has no face & you have no brains. You are lost & going no where.

          • And you never will because you mind is block of any possibility other than your own idea. Other people don’t see God but feel his presence with an open heart and love for others. It gives the kind of joy you will never know with negative thinking and making the rest feel like idiots. Even if there no God my life will have fuller than yours.

          • Amen, Nellie. “God is spirit and those, who worship Him must do so in spirit and truth.” John 4:24.
            The problem here is that the likes of Faye Hayes demand that He be seen, when all you have to do, in order to prove the resurrection is realize the fact that He “has written the truth of the resurrection, not in books alone, but in ever leaf in springtime,” (That is a quote I found, attributed to Martin Luther.)

            Of course, to the atheist, they would rather fear the nothingness, they expect to appear, after their death, than to believe in eternal life, simply because of their stubborn nature.
            The son, taken to the Supreme Court, by Madalyn Murray-O’Hare, when she convinced that liberal-minded group to begin removing God from America, became a Christian and wrote an open letter to her.
            In that letter he mentioned how she denied God, but took His Name in vain, numerous times, daily.

            Lastly, Galatians 6:7 promises that whatever a person sows, he/she will reap. So, keep sowing either righteousness or foolishness and you know what you’ll reap.

          • Faye your comment about never seeing a picture of God though you’ve seen one of earth and moon is very sad statement. Well if you haven’t seen a pic of him on your smart phone he must not be real then. Reminds me of the Pharisees telling Jesus that if he would take himself off the cross they would believe him.

          • Religion, or rather, religions do make sense. But when it comes to practicing a religion it does require logical, rational thinking but with the limitations that a religion might impose.

          • Linda your an atheist, so what? I don’t want to convert you to anything, but don’t try to deny me my beliefs, I don’t believe any ones faith should be forced on someone else. Leave us alone that do have honest beliefs.

          • But, if your beliefs prevent you from doing your job, resign & find another job, that doesn’t offend your beliefs. You can’t have it both ways. Either do your job as it is supposed to be done or leave!

          • Exactly.

          • Seems to me she is upholding the county and state laws, for that matter the Constitution. If the two lesbians and the old bitch would have recused themselves like they should have, we wouldn’t be having this conversation.
            It’s really simple, the legislative writes the law, the executive implements them and the judiciary determines their constitutionality, so this whole “gay” marriage debacle is unconstitutional and should not have been implemented.

          • So when SCOTUS ended segregation you opposed it? And when SCOTUS ended laws against mixed racial marriages you opposed that? SCOTUS is interpreting state laws as to whether they are constitutional or not. They are not creating laws but either uphold a law or reject a law on constitutional grounds.

          • I agree with you 100%.

          • So when 34 states voted down queer marriage, some of them twice, that meant that the “commerce clause”‘usurped states rights? I don’t think so. Be a lot of people disappointed when the states take back what is theirs.
            All this is letting less than 1% of the population force their perverted lifestyle on the rest of us. What are you going to do when it’s your child getting sodomized?
            Those queers target the people who don’t buy into this, I mean how difficult can it be to find a gay florist or cake decorater? Like somebody said why aren’t they forcing this on the muslims?

          • So, you are feeling the pressure to be gay? When it comes to child abuse – normally that’s straight people. No more difficult than finding gay clergy. But what you are being forced to do – that gays have civil rights also? If you haven’t noticed, the majority of Americans approve of gay marriage. But you didn’t answer my questions – did you disapprove of SCOTUS ending segregation instead of leaving it to state legislatures? Did you disapprove of SCOTUS finding laws against mixed marriages unconstitutional, as well?

          • So you’re trying that gambit. Ain’t falling forthat. The black people really didn’t have much choice now did they. As for interracial marriage, it’s of little consequence for the adults, but I have nothing but sympathy for the children. For the few that are successful or happy there’s a whole bunch who lead miserable lives. I know several and am related to some.
            No the majority don’t approve of this, get your heads out of the MSM’s ass, boy!
            .

          • It’s the catholic church who has a monopoly on sodomizing little boys. And the roman catholic church has turned a blind eye & continues to this day , to allow priest to remain in the church, so they can carry on their perverted lifestyles, raping little innocent children, with the eyes of your god upon them ?? Gays are targeting no one. All they are asking for are equal rights under the law & not to be discriminated against based solely on their sexual preferences. You are a hateful & bigoted Christian , who has no respect for people who are different from you, by calling them queers. Your god would be so proud of you.

          • Do you really have a clue lady. Do you know what the gay lifestyle is, it’s nothing but sodomy. Their agenda is trying to ruin the country and you braindead idiots keep sticking up for them. Well check out how much they’re willing to stick up for anybody else’s rights. Remember what goes around comes around.
            They’ll wish they’d stayed in the closet.

          • My beliefs have never prevented me from doing my job, Reva. Those, who came over and asked me questions about my spiritual life and then decided to persecute me because of it, did.

          • Mike G…Did you mean to say, “a STUBBORN atheist”?
            The reason I ask is because I’ve gone toe-to-toe, with a few, who, like Linda, demand God ain’t there.
            They will make excuse, after excuse … all day long, but they cannot overcome the fact that doctors, all over the state of Georgia, are scratching their collective heads that I am 54 years old and, according to medical science, I should not have lived past 10 (of 13, or 37 or 39).
            If you ask the man, who performed my second brain surgery, in 1974, he’ll tell you what he told my dad (in 1992)…they are shocked I am still here.
            I am here because Christ’s tomb is empty and He answers the petitions of the righteous. When I was in deep comas, people prayed me out.
            That won’t change, simply because some unbeliever demands Buddha is just as much god as my Jesus.

          • Mike G: I don’t think Linda or anyone else, who denies the truth, will ever leave us alone.
            Why? Because they don’t want someone to have what they don’t have. I don’t understand what people, like you (those, who have absolutely NO joy, want to makes sure nobody else has any, either.
            Guess what? My joy is in the Lord and nothing (absolutely NOTHING) they say or do will change that.

            When I was in high school, kids tried to get me into the pothead culture. I would tell them that marijuana and alcohol would give them a “high” and then lead to a let down.
            My Jesus gives me a high that never goes away, so the likes of people, who demand that He isn’t Who He says He is, doesn’t bother me!

          • @Lind, God is not hiding, nor is he dead. He rose upon the third day of resurrection. He lives, he lives today as he did the days before. God is in spirit. He lives within you. He is right here with you, even the sinners. He gives each one of us chance after chance to repent., meaning change from your wicky ways. When judgment day comes no one will have an excuse. He says everything that has breathe shall know about him! We are in a spiritual warfare, this is not about the person themselves, it is about the spirit within you. We fight against the demonic spirit, fouls and the evil of the airs, and these things do exist. In order for these things to make sense to you stop struggling with them and ask God to come into your life and lead you, asking him for wisdom, knowledge and understanding that man cannot give. . It may not happen all at once, but you will begin to notice a difference. God brings us through steps, like a child learning. He teaches and show us things that no human man or woman can do. He gives us peach in the mist of the storms!

          • Sheila: You’re a tad bit wrong. He only lives in those, who believe and, unfortunately, Linda is too stubborn to believe, so He is nowhere near her.

          • He lives in the Christians’ hearts and he is sitting on the right hand side of the Father making intercession for us. Glory to God!!

          • God with a gun-I’m sure that he’s proud of you.

          • Bob, Your statement makes no sense, whatsoever!

          • A sense of irony for you Mr Frazier…………

          • I guess Frazier doesn’t know the definition of irony- use of words to express the opposite of the literal meaning.

          • Yep! I know my Father is proud of me. If He wasn’t proud of me then I wouldn’t be here. And yes with a gun in hand. He didn’t want us to be little wimps and cower away. But I don’t see God with a gun, I see me with a gun.

          • Amen, Karen. Anyone, who denies that truth isn’t playing with a full deck.

          • Bullshit!! Anyone who really believes in an invisible sky daddy is not playing with a full deck. Truth- agreement with fact or reality. No facts, proof or evidence & You are definitely NOT living in reality- Something that is real- genuine, not imaginary. Like I stated before your god was created from your imagination, nothing more.

          • Faye Hayes, “Faith comenth by hearing and hearing by the Word of God,” Romans 10:17.
            Well, of course, that faith is limited to those, who believe and you have proven you’re not one of us.
            Unfortunately, unless you find the King of kings and make Him Lord over your life, you will bow down in the Lake of Fire and scream that you want to know Him.
            Sadly, it will be too late, then!

          • Wow!! I’m so scared, you’ve got me shaking in my boots. You Christians are just too funny. LOL!!!

          • Your use of cursing illustrates immaturity. Your refusal to believe what is proven in every waking hour (you cannot prove He is not there, because everything, around you, was created by Him. Even the things, men have created, were made, using components God Almighty provided and the understanding that only comes from Him.

            I would say more but it’s obvious, from your denial, that you’re already in WAY over your head.

          • If he is sitting at the right hand, then the 3 in 1 propaganda is a lie.

            Me, I am a bit more concerned with the First Commandment:

            I am the Lord thy God, thou shalt have no other Gods before me.

            That was not JC talking in the burning bush, it wasn’t JC talking on the mountain top.

          • No, iit wasn’t Jesus talking from the burning bush nor was it Jesus talking on the mountain top. It was The Great I Am aka GOD!!!

          • Burning bush??? LOL!! The only thing burned out is that brain of yours, from all those years of religious indoctrination. Time to wake up & smell the coffee.

          • Christianity’s 3 in 1 propaganda utilized to get around the First Commandment.

          • HOGWASH!!!!!!!

          • @Linda, one other thing, I am not trying to tell you how to live, and I am not trying to convert you, that is your choice. . I am spreading the word of God. It is your choice to accept him or not.

          • All I see you spreading is a pile of horse manure. LOL!!

          • Oh ye of little faith!

          • Karen Lee King: Paul said to the Romans, “Faith cometh by hearing and hearing by the Word of God.” (Ro. 10:17)
            The problem is, Faye, as well as the majority, don’t desire faith and don’t hear the Word of God.
            Because of that, the come into debates and demand we, those, who have received faith and, by it, believe that He is and that He is a Rewarder of those, who seek Him .
            Their desire is to pull us out of the high we’re in.
            A place they know nothing about and a joy they will never see, lest they repent.

          • Oh ye of little intelligence!!

          • You, like all other unbelievers, demand that His resurrection is trash, manure, heresy or any other adjective you can come up with.
            However, you, nor anyone else can prove He didn’t rise from His tomb. One man told me “the Bible is hearsay, passed on from one generation to another.’
            When I asked how he explains the empty tomb, he replied that he believes the body of the Christ was stolen by His disciples. I told him he’d just quoted the Word of God because it is recorded, therein, that the religious leaders attempted to bribe the Roman guards into saying that had happened.

            Sheila, none of this is new. Nothing the unbelievers, who blatantly refuse to accept the Truth (that is according to John, chapter 14, verse 6). You only have to realize that the Lord promised this one thing: More will find the large gate and large path, leading to damnation, than will find the narrow gate and narrow path, leading to eternal life – for anyone, who is interested, that is found in Matthew, chapter seven, verses 13 and 14.

          • However, YOU , nor anyone else can prove that your jesus did rise from the dead. It’s all hearsay & wishful thinking. An empty tomb proves nothing. It’s more believable that his body was stolen by his disciples & they buried him in a different location , where no one would find him. After all, he was just a man, not the son of god. He was crucified, died & was buried. End of story.

          • Miracles abound everywhere….some choose to ignore them. God gives us signs all the time….

          • Miracles abound everywhere ?? Can you give me some examples of these so called miracles that you have witnessed & seen with your own eyes ? I don’t believe in miracles or signs from your god, so how would you go about convincing me that miracles do occur, without proof or evidence ? Please enlighten me.

          • It is a miracle that you haven’t hit by lightening. Seriously, just the fact you born is a miracle. The complexity of the human body is pure genius.

          • Well, for one, He healed me of asthma. I had no medical treatment, but many asked God to heal me, and He did.

          • It’s a grand feeling, Easterbeliever, isn’t it?

          • Absolutely!

          • Karen Lee King