The Planned Failure of Obamacare

If you didn’t already suspect that President Obama’s Affordable Care Act was just a stepping stone towards socialized medicine, a recent analysis from the New York Times indicates that we’re moving into the “it’s not working” phase of the program. After defending Obama’s plan for years, our media masters are starting to feel comfortable pointing out what conservatives have been screaming about since the beginning: Namely, that this system just isn’t going to work.

In the piece, the New York Times points to a number of problems with the current state of affairs: Patients are limited to a very narrow network of hospitals and doctors, the insurance is basically worthless when you leave your home state, the “keep your children on the plan until they’re 26” provision doesn’t work when grown children move out of state, prescriptions are more expensive, and premiums are going through the roof.

What’s to be done about it? Scrap the system and go with something that puts true choice back in the hands of the American people? Abide by capitalistic principles and let these insurance companies compete for the good of patients?

No, no. It’s this:

This disappointment is fueling renewed interest in a “public option” that would supplement current offerings. That idea found support from both Senator Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton as the Affordable Care Act was making its way through Congress. It was taken up again last week by Mrs. Clinton, when she suggested allowing people 55 and over to buy into Medicare, the government-run insurance for people 65 and over, which is accepted by virtually all hospitals.

Yes, the mask is starting to fall and it’s becoming increasingly clear that Obamacare was meant to fail from the beginning. Democrats have one and only one response to the failures of their policies: double-down on said policies. And when it comes to healthcare, it’s been their goal to adopt universal coverage for decades. The ACA was just a way to get Americans used to the idea of the federal government running the show.

Republicans have no time to spare when it comes to finding an Obamacare replacement plan. They’ve been twiddling their fingers for long enough. Republicans have been reliable critics of the president’s healthcare plan, but they have been woefully inadequate when it comes to replacing it with sensible legislation. Until they have a plan they can sell to the public, they are powerless.

The time to act is now. If we wait until Obamacare comes crashing down in a smoldering heap of ruin, Democrats will use the chaos to push us towards socialized medicine. We must repeal and replace before it’s too late.

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790 comments

  1. Actually in states where governors have a brain and did a state exchange and expanded Medicare Obamacare is working just fine. States that did a state exchange give participants 5-25 insure companies to choose from. All with networks of dr’s and hospitals of all sizes. It’s your choose as to what network you want , what insure company you want and what premium you want to pay. All recipients, including students under 26 can use their coverage in any state.
    Now if you live in a state governed by a republican you have the description you described…….too bad. By the way, guess who still has state government paid for health insure??? Every single red state governor, while they screw everyone else in their state out of being able to see a dr. People in those states are dying because they can’t see a dr.
    20 million Americans can see a dr since ACA became effective, thank God.

    • I heard and read that around 90% of the state exchanges are going bankrupt and many large insurers are getting out. Where did you get your facts? I’d like to check it out.

      • Anthem blue cross stock was $55 a share in 2010 when ACA began. Today Anthem stock is $130 plus a share = ACA enrollment in 14 states those blue cross blue shield plans do business.

        • About one hour ago I saw that 2 more ins. cos. are dropping out. Have you seen the premium and deductible increases and the decreases in doctor choices, (cause they’re dropping out too)? The liar in chief said 40 million people were without health ins. He also said no ones premiums would go up by even a dime, you could keep your doctor and your current plan. All blatant LIES. With the 20 million you just posted , that means that the health ins. was terribly disrupted for 280 million people for the benefit of 20 million. By simple math, that means 14 people got screwed around for each one that doesn’t pay. That doesn’t seem fair to me. Just because 1 ins. cos. stock went up, that doesn’t mean the ones that lost millions of $ are happy either.

          • NY is adding 3 more insure companies to its state exchange for 2017. The president did not say premiums would not go up!. We have too many fat, smoking, non-exercising and unhealthy Americans for that to happen. Somehow you folks don’t get that many heart attacks, strokes, high blood pressure/cholesterol rx etc claims have to be PAID!! The healthier we are as a country the cheaper our health insure premiums will be. Start exercising!!! Or something!!!

            I kept my plan and so did every policeman, fireman, city//state/federal employee, so did every Fox News employee, every Exxon employee, every Koch employee etc etc etc across this country. So did every republican governor who is screwing their constituents and I bet you kept your health plan, you hypocrite.

            The folks in states that did state exchanges and expanded Medicaid are doing just fine. If you live in a republican led state I am sure you have issues….. Too bad, move.

          • I didn’t think a dumba$$oc RAT could carry on a civil discussion without resorting to name calling. I was right. So FVCK YOU you piece of $hit.

          • facts appear to hard for you to answer I see.

          • Keep it up. Make up your own facts. Only you believe them. Are you gonna tell us where you got your education? Probably afraid to. We understand.

          • I gave you facts, I can’t help you understand facts.

          • You are a LIAR. Your facts come from Jonathan Gruber and Josh Earnest, 2 Oblablabla henchmen, paid liars.This horse crap health plan should be gone by this time next year.

          • That’s what the repubs said 6 years ago!!! I don’t need to go to anyone for facts. You lost, ACA is here to stay.

          • So is money laundering and lying and redistribution. Maybe you want reparations to. Go away you cockroach.

          • Aw, to many facts for ya?!! ACA IS HERE TO STAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

          • I told you to go back to 4th grade. You ignorant cockroach, do you know the difference between “to” and “too” ? Go away like a little cretin and stop with your ignorant lies you F’n POS.

          • So hard to educate ignorance. Not worried, as there aren’t enough of you to screw things up again……. Bye!?

          • You’ve proven yourself a LIAR. All on here now know you are nothinhjgn but an untrustworthy Dumba$$oc RAT. Like your incompetent,quota, lying president. You should be ashamed of yourself, but libturds like you and your ilk never understand the obnoxious behavior you exhibit. PATHETIC Seems like the letters you use “dh” are either what you are or what you eat……… Dick Head. Go away forever you lying loser.

          • Aw, you lost. AGAIN!!!!!!!!!

          • You lost when God decided who’d get brains. Also, character, integrity, common sense, parentage, education etc. You be a lyin’ loser.

          • And ACA is here and doing just fine!!!!!!

          • If you had 2 nickles to rub together, I’d bet that. But too many nigroes owe me too much money now, as they cheat me (by not paying for services) so I wouldn’t trust a racist like y’all. Now go make me some pancakes.

          • I gave you facts, I can’t help you understand facts.

    • You need a laxative severely! F.O.S.
      While you wait for results, I have a joke for you.
      How do you give a liberal a lobotomy?
      You stick an ice pick in his rectum.

    • You care to name a state? You spew the generalizations copied from a george soros paid spam site.

      I live in CA, my premiums are up significantly, AND my services rendered are down… Lose/lose for this guy who lives in one of those States that took the Government payoffs. Your BS isn’t flying with me.

      • NY and CA are doing just fine for folks who had zero health insure. First of all with health insure they can now see a dr early in their illness, which over time is cheaper to treat. If you don’t have health insure you don’t go for treatment. By the time you do go you are deathly ill you end up at the costliest place, the ER!! The number one bankruptcy reason in this US, per US Bankruptcy Court was medical bills.

        You do know Premiums are collected to pay the claims so the 20 million folks across this country who had zero health insure went to the dr when the got health insure!! Of course premiums went up, but not as much has they had been going up over the last 20 years. If you chose a plan that did not give you what you needed in benefits ” open enrollment” happens every November. You have a choice on the plan that fits your needs, change to a different plan on Califirnia’s state exchange. If you get your health insure thru your employer, like 80% of most Americans you also have a period once a year to change your plan. I suggest you check with your human resources ofc when yours is…… You obviously chose the wrong plan for you and your family. Because of Obamacare you get to change your plan!!! Go for it.

        • All sound great but all your talking points are just that, talking points. They have very little to do with reality.

          You seem to ignore the VAST Majority of people in CA are suffering under this legislation. My personal costs have SKYROCKETED, and I am not alone. I now PAY for those very preventative procedures that you claim are saving us so much money… I am now opting OUT of preventative measures that were once free and covered in my healthcare during annual office visits.

          My employer now offers 0bamacare, and it is far worse and more expensive than before.

          You say 20 million that had ZERO health insurance, but I believe that is a lie. Only about 5 million were uninsured and then became insured, the others lost their insurance, to become uninsured and then were put back on…. Those should not count.

          And we haven’t even talked about the death panels… I got to deal with them first hand in my Mom’s passing…. But, hey, I am forced to choose between bad and worse… Thanks 0bamacare.

          • Under ACA EVERY person has a zero copay and zero deductiable annual physical. That is also called preventative care. If you are being charged then it’s not your once a year annual physical.

            My employer did not stop offering health benefits to us once Obamacare became effective. Sounds like your employer did. That was your employers choice that put you in the situation of bad to worse.

            The only death panels happened to folks who had zero health insure prior to ACA. I am sorry about your mom, as I lost mine, but it was not because she did not have health insure. She worked for GE and all GE retirees had health insure into retirement plus Medicare. She did not go bankrupt before she died paying dr and hosp bills.

          • It must be the second visit and every one after that when you are hit with $100 copays…. Me bad. Little things like blood tests used to be free… not now.

            You are correct, about the bad to worse thing, My employer went from a employee friendly plan to 0bamacare.

            Wrong about the death panels, they are alive and well. The denials of death panels are just more lies…

            My Mom was fully covered here in CA with Medicare and Medical… The death panels hastened her death by denying her the coverage she needed. The Family was unable (My Mom Refused to pay for it) to keep here in the treatment center that she needed so she was moved to a center that simply let her die… My Mom did not live long enough to go bankrupt, but if she had gone bankrupt, they would have moved her back into the facility that could have saved her life…. Nice system… The system only works if you are flat broke, you pay for it until you are.

            The puke insurance companies follow their instructions well, they probably got a big fat check for denying her the treatments she needed.

            Look, you are propagating the same lies that 0bama told… Why do you think they will work here and now? Do you think we are fools?

          • ACA is working in my state. The 20 million Americans that can now see a dr are very happy. Maybe you need to talk to some of them. Again, I am sorry about your mom.

          • I don’t believe your lying arse.

          • That’s your problem.

          • Under the Unaffordable care act… UCA… EVERY person pays more for less and the actual term Affordable care Act is just another Government generated oxymoron.

            As one gets older, the yearly physicals are not enough, and that is when you end up paying through the teeth via copays and yearly minimums…

            The death panels exist and are very real, BECAUSE OF ACA. What you say is an outright lie, shame on you for spreading it.

            My mother was covered under Medical, and the death panels decided she could not stay in the facility that was keeping her alive. So the death panel forced her to move to a different cheaper home, where as predicted without the treatments at the more sophisticated and more expensive facility, she didn’t last long. Even the Doctors and the first facility fought to keep my Mom at the first fascility, but to no avail. The pencil pushing death panelist, saved the Government/Insurance company some money…

            Funny thing is, IF my Mother had been dead broke, the Death Panelists would have left her in the first facility. My Mom too died without having to go bankrupt….

            I wish she had…….

          • You need help. ACA works just fine in my state and every other state where the governor did a state exchange.

            It sounds like your mom had Medicare, the plan for folks over 65. That is not ACA/Obamacare. There are no death panels on either.

          • There are death panels… Little stupid insurance pukes that read from a chart and insist people go home after so many days at a facility… These pukes kick the people out of the care facility based only on days there, and when the insurance run is allowed to run out according to some law or accountant. The process is brutally cruel and ugly…

          • All insur policies way before ACA had the same requirements. You just did not have a sick or dying mother back then.

          • Yep so to deny that they do not exist in ACA is a lie.

  2. folks whose worse mitt romney or paul ryan””””””””””””remember romneycare another failure
    i feel paul ryan is a total failure ””’big disaster for this country”””’ HE MUST GO’
    ””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””DONALD TRUMP 2016

  3. Millions of Americans thank Pres. Obama for creating the Affordable Care Act, a.k.a. Obamacare. Agree that it’s not perfect. Besides denouncing it, what has the GOP come up with as an alternative. And when complaining about “Socialized Medicine”, just what the hell do you call Medicare, or even Social Security?

    • They’re called Ponzi Schemes. Do you understand how they (don’t) work? Did you ever see what the actual math shows one would have accrued if they’d invested their money in the stock market instead of had it confiscated thru Social Security? I bet you haven’t. Oblablabla is incompetent and a lying FOOL. I suggest you get some facts before you post any more fawning bull $hit.

      • When logic fails, then resort to ad hominem attacks.

        • As I replied to dh, 280 million people had their health ins. terribly disrupted by an incompetent liar. Many of the 20 million that get it for free are not happy and many who are supposed to pay a minimum premium aren’t even paying that. Oblablabla Care is a dismal failure. Your post is an ad hominem attack. Do you see the IRONY there?

          • No one has free health insure thru ACA. All contribute. Some more than others, but EVERYONE pays. Obviously as the president said during a commencement address yesterday, you don’t know what you are talking about.

          • I know people that don’t work and never worked. If people never had an income or savings, how do they pay? You have a misguided assessment of how much you know. Where do you work?

          • And there is the reason for ACA.

          • Your last comment just proved you are an F’n LIAR. As you posted, “Everyone pays” . Not too bright are you? For an idiot liberal who’s supposed to believe in everything “Science” like “Evolution” , do you understand the theory of “Survival of the Fittest”? Darwin’s Theory concluded that the “Fittest” had the genes that were better for the species to survive and strive in the future. Or are you one of the idiots who pick and choose the science that fits the dumba$$oc RAT propaganda? Go back and finish 4th grade.

          • Everyone pays, your ignorance becomes you.

          • Your ignorance IS you. Tell us, if a person has no money or job, how does that person pay? This oughta be good!

          • Anyone on ACA pays. That was the orginal discussion.

            If you are on disability, like many of our service folks or elderly or under the poverty level you have Medicaid and or Medicare disability not ACA.

          • You keep avoiding the question. Liars do that alot, trying to keep their # of lies to a minimum. AGAIN, if a person has no money or job and is not disabled, how do they pay?

          • Americans Wake Up

            backtracking a little are we?

          • Not me! Apparently English is not his/her first language.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Good God, you’re a fucking stupid lying misinformed sausage fingered idiot.

          • You can’t even answer the question. Evolution needs to chlorinate you and your ghetto family out of the gene pool. Tell us what bastion of liberal ghettoism you got your post doc. degree from. You ignant cretin. Tell us how many welfare programs you’re signed up for and how much you get monthly. I pity your race.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Don’t pity whitey because he so mighty! You nothing but a nigga, but that don’t matta, now go fuck off!

          • Awww, did you use the ” N ” word. You racist POS. The 4th grade level of spelling and grammar betray your edumacation (Ha) and your race. Go back to elementary school and get a job you f’n ignant LEACH.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Whoa! Nigga, don’t be so negative! U b the only 1 who matters to the powers that b! Go in the DEVIL’s grace and b1 with those you blow.

          • Hey nigra, you b on da down low? Why u b fraid 2 tell us ns what cooledge you went 2 and how u paid 4 it? Is it cause u a F’n LEACH. How u like bein’ da underbelly of society? Stupid and unedumacated ?Livin’ off other’s taxes. You proud a dat. You black and u proud nigga boy? S’all u fools got. demandin’ free stuff from workin’ folks. U should be ashamed. You blood sukin’ parasite. Go 2 school and get a job, eggplant.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Yessum, eyes be a good nigga massa!

          • You should go to the lake for a nice long swim. Den you b a good nigga.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Dis nigga goes a swimmin’ every mornin’ for half an hour. What the fuck do you do..masterbate?

          • Swimmin’ in da toilet don’t count, nigga. Yo mama, Jemimah do dat fo me in her mouf.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Hey Uncle Ben, this nigga gonna use you as his boy, just like them Cock brothers.

          • OK uncle Remus. you mean you’n yo boyfren, be da cock bros?

          • Hey nigga. Whatchu think bout brother Charles Wade pimpin’ out a 17 yr. old sista and then gettin a visit to nigga Oblablabla in da white house. Classy, huh? Did you go to Chi. Tribune to see article in business section Thurs. 5/19/2016 and see how Oblablabla care is bankrupting ins. cos. and people are droppin’ out of this bulls$hit progfram. Or can’t you afford a newspaper? nigga HA HA HA

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Yo, yo yo brutha! I agree with ‘yall its great. Glad your down with the bros.

          • Yea da bros. have added so much to the betterment of American society. Like killin’ off other bros. to get em off welfare roles and adding numbers to the prison population. and where would parole officers be if not for all the convicted felons Oblablabla is releasing? Dey needs da work boy.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Fuck ya bro! I’m down with ya. It’s funny, but whitey is the fastest disappearing demographic in the U.S. Mostly due to suicide and heroin overdoses. What a bunch of pussies who can’t handle a fucking thing. Whites are fucking nuts!

          • Yep, us nigras be way smartr den dem. We knows how to scam idiot Dumba$$oc RAT party outa all dat welfare, just for votin fo em . HA HA HA

          • StupidConservativeValues

            “HA HA HA” Really!?!

          • Ya, das right, we we. Yall shud see da free stuff I be gettin. Ova $50 lage just fo lyin n votin. HA HA HA I be rich n neva gotta woik 1 day fo it.

          • The only way you’re down with em is DOWN LOW, HA HA HA HA

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Your humor bar is pretty low there idiot.

          • Yo brofriend be lookin fo yo butt, or yo mouf.

          • You mouth breathing knuckle dragging ghetto APE. Where did you get your post doc. degree? It’s ignant fools like you who are the problem in the US. Uneducated leaches like you and your people need to be chlorinated out of the gene pool.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Post doc at Loyola. You have sausage fingers, so don’t worry, even though you have the posture of a knuckle dragger, your wittle fingers can’t hit the ground

          • More like LIE ola. How’d you get in? How much did you pay for tuition? Answer those truthfully and I’ll know. I know you won’t. LIAR.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            The premise of your “questions” make absolutely no sense at all. You must have been home schooled by Christians.

          • Just making sure your the leach-like parasite on society that you seem to be. Have the grades? Pay your “Fair Share”? HA HA HA If you can afford a newspaper , other than The Defender look at Chicago Tribune’s Business section page 1 Thurs. 5/19/16, top article about Ins Cos. and how they’re losing millions and people dropping out of Ovomitcare. Get back to me when you have a little knowledge instead of your a$$wipe Dumba$$oc RAT talking points. Cause they make no sense, like you, you F’n dimwit.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            “Ins Cos. and how they’re losing millions and people dropping out of Ovomitcare.” Awwww, the poor insurance companies, after making so much money off our backs for so many years, we can’t expect them to “take a cut in pay,” so they raise their prices on us and you roll over like a pussy. You’re a fucking dumb shit rube who is being used and is too dumb to realize it.

          • If a slime bag like you could afford a newspaper, maybe you could see. You dumb piece of crap. Your boyfriend’s ready for you.

          • My brutha, why da white man be doin’ dis to us’ns. Me n Cardell Hayes, Marcus Owens, Larmondo Allen, an’ Auwin Dargin be gettin’ a bad rap. What b da deal. Boy, dis cuntry be racist. Why canst’s dey be lettin’ us do dis $heet? Afta ow, we was slaaaaves. I jus wan’st’s ta be MO equa. Boy ges’t’s me sum free $heeet o we gun’stas riot sum mo an boo un sum din down. Afta ow, we can’st’s be racistts s cause we be da minority.

          • Everyone doesn’t pay, the middle class contributes, and the Rich and poor don’t….

            That is why 0bama opted out…

          • Everyone pays unless you are the boss in your company who makes the rules. Everyone on Obamacare pays.

          • Except Senators and those public employees that have been exempted by the Criminals that put the Tax into action.

          • They also pay, no one is exempt, not even the president.

          • They do not pay for or into 0bamacare.

          • They all pay whether you apply for ACA or your employer offers health insur. Ask any federal employee. The 30% taken out of their paycheck is not a joke. The fed gov’t pays 70% of the premium. Any large company usually pays a portion of an employee’s insur. Mine does and I am sure so does yours.

            Anyone who is on ACA……. Separate from employer health insurance…..pays a portion of their premium. That amount depends on your income. When you sign up for ACA on-line you have to add in your financials. Then it’s determined if you are eligible for any subsidy or not. Even with a subsidy you still pay a portion of your premium.

        • StupidConservativeValues

          It always fails when trying to talk reason to conservatives…asshole.

      • I bet you will be taking your social security check when you turn 65 if you haven’t already.

        • SS was not a ponzi scheme, that is it wasn’t until politicians raided the chauffeurs.

          • SS still is not a ponzi scheme.

          • If it is broke, it is…. It can not sustain itself past 2033, or maybe 2034 depending on how you cook the books…

          • I contribute to my ss and so do you, idiot. It’s doing fine and will continue to work for all of us.

          • Sure it will, and if you believe that you will probably go all in for 0bamacare. I am not the one that believed the liar in chief that sold you 0bamacare…. Who is the idiot???

          • I don’t need Obamacare, my employer did not screw me and canc our company health plan. Also my governor did a state exchange and expanded Medicaid so those in my state who needed health insure have 10 to 20 health insure companies to chose from on our state exchange based on their benefit needs and budget.

            Sounds like you, your governor and your party are the idiots. (Although your governor made sure he/she kept their state government health insure plan!!! As did all the republicans in congress). Looks like your party just screwed you voters!!!

          • Yep, my Governor, Jerry Brown is a liberal idiot. So are the rest of CA politicians.

            Democrats have been screwing Californians for years now with liberal lies.

          • ACA is working in CA just fine. You are the idiot for not choosing a plan that works for you and your family. You have many choices on your state exchange, I helped my niece who turned 26 look at the many available options for the benefits she needed and the docs/hosp she wanted.

          • Not as simple as that cupcake….

            Only paid trolls like yourself like 0bamacare… When you get out into the real world, you will find that a VAST majority of people are being hurt by 0bamacare and your success stories are very hard to find…..

            Your niece at 26 does not have background to determine if she is better off now or before 0bamacare… I’ll bet she pays more for her Government MANDATED TAXES than she did before… EVERYBODY DOES,,,,

          • Sorry, wrong. She paid zero prior to turning 26 as she was covered under her parents work plan.

            You may want to talk to the millions of Americans who had to declare bankruptcy due to zero health insure coverage due to pre-existing conditions or hosp bills they just could not afford. Those 20 million people are pretty happy to have ACA.

          • Sorry, HER parents paid, and her parents will probably tell you that it was cheaper before 0bamacare, and you will lie on this post and say that they said it was more expensive…

            That is what liberals do.

          • Her parents paid a portion of the premium thru their employer like they always did for family coverage. Obamacare did not change the cost of their health plan thru their employer. It did save them $$$$$$$$$ as they did not have to buy a plan or help their daughter buy a plan until she turned 26.

            Millions of Americans saved $$$$$$$$$$$, probably even you.

          • Nope, hundreds of millions are paying more…. Just like me.

          • Go yell at your governor who is screwing you by not doing a state exchange where you would have a choice in premiums. Prior to ACA if you had a pre-existing condition or exceeded your max you had zero choice, you were canc or in many cases you couldn’t even purchase a plan, you just went bankrupt.

            ps….. If you live in a red state Your governor made sure he or she kept their paid for state government health plans!!!! If you live in a state with a state exchange like I do you have many health insurance companies on your exchange with many different rates/benefits. You as a consumer can chose the premium/benefits that works for you and your family. Like over 1 million did in my state.

          • CA has plenty of bad choices. Red State, what you talking about.

            Pre Existing conditions could have been handled better with other options.

          • CA is many options to chose from. You apparently did not chose wisely

          • All my options required more money, less services, and different doctors. Tell me, was I lied to?

            Yes.

          • Americans Wake Up

            New numbers by CDO last week were by 2022 -2027

          • Correct numbers by the CBO….. 2040

          • Even worse, no different than any other number coming out of our Government these days….. Worse.

          • The definition of a Ponzi Scheme is a system where initial investors are paid of by potential future investors. The big problem is dumbassoc RAT politicians keep stealing money to give to their constituents in order to buy their votes. Don’t you know?

          • We forgive bush for borrowing!!!!

          • Which lying moron said it was unpatriotic to run up the national debt, and then ran it up to $20 trillion? You must have a short memory. I see a few others,on here, think you’re a jackass too. Have fun defending socialism you dimwit.

          • Took 20 billion to clean up and pay for the mess bush handed Obama on 1/20/09.

          • wa wa wa still crying about Bush I see.

          • Well the last depression took 20 years to clean up, sorry it’s taken Obama so long to clean up the bush depression. We all watched bush do Medicare d and not pay for it, we all watched bush lose 800,000 jobs a month that collapsed our economy, we all watched lying Cheney take us to wars not paid for and we watched more than 5,000 Americans die in those wars charged to all of us. Where were you?

          • And your still crying about Bush….. Your 0bama has failed, he can not clean anything up, nor is that his goal.

            0bama wants to make things worse. That is the only way to explain his actions.

          • I see zero answers to my FACTS about the mess bush and lying Cheney dumped on Pres Obama and the rest if us…… Not surprised.

          • That is so lame, you have zero facts to support your Bush/Cheney lying garbage.

            Prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that Bush lied about WMD’s…. You can’t prove anything more than Bush was WRONG about WMD’s, far smarter people than yourself have failed at this challenge….

            If you can not prove this, nothing you have said on these posts is worth listening to, as you are as big a liar as 0bama himself.

          • FACTS:
            12/31/08 the stock market was 6,000………today 17,000 plus
            12/31/08 auto industry was going bankrupt …….2015 was the auto industry’s best year ever.
            12/31/08 millions of Americans could not see a dr…….12/31/15 12 million Americans can now see a dr.
            12/31/08 bin laden was alive……..12/31/15 bin laden is dead
            12/31/08 5,000 plus Americans were killed/maimed in Iraq …….. Not today

            That’s the short list.

          • Facts,

            Democrats needed a stock market crash to get 0bama elected…. They manufactured it.
            The bail outs were a bust for the American People.
            If you like your Dr. you can keep your Dr….. WAS A LIE
            If 0bama was a true leader, he would give credit where credit is due…. Seal Team Six killed 0sama…
            Many more Americans have died in 0bama’s war than were killed/maimed during the Bush wars…

            OK liar, you still have not provided any proof of a Bush lie…. And you can’t you slimy hypocrite.

          • Where are your facts? I gave you facts. The stock market was 6,000 when bush left ofc. It’s not now, it’s 17,000 plus!!!! That is called a fact. Your sentences are not facts. Seal team six could not kill bin laden without a plan. Obama’s plan was executed by seal team six. There have not been 10,000 plus Americans killed or maimed in any war since bush left ofc. On 12/31/08 bush was losing 800,00 jobs a month. Since Obama has been in ofc he has had 71 straight months of job growth. Horrible GOP policies tanked our economy. The hole was so deep we are still climbing out of the hole.

            Again, actual facts. Go away, see you in November when the smartest most experienced person, Hillary Clinton ever beats the dangerous racist bigot trump.

          • So you ignore the fact that 0bama lied to us, and deny that his lies are facts…. Don’t be stupid.

            So the Stock market during the Bush days topped out at what. 12,000…. The stock market goes up, the stock market goes down…. How is it that every President only takes credit for the plus side and ignores the negative side.

            If you look at the number of Americans killed or maimed in the war since 0bama took office, you would be appalled, the numbers are going up not down. The MEDIA is simply not reporting them anymore. It is called bias by omission, they only report the good things about 0bama and ignore the bad.

            Your talking point data has nothing to do with the real world… Hillary is not that smart, she really screwed up Libya, was not present during her 3am phone call, and certainly does not have a track record to write home about. .

          • Then why did he “Unpatriotically” run it up to 20 trillion? You forgot to address the fungible comment on the last post. Yea, I bet you forgot. You need to be schooled about the “Community Reinvestment Act”, another Dumba$$oc RAT scam that was the main reason for the real estate bubble. Don’t you know? Or afraid to face the facts?

          • Americans Wake Up

            Sorry, but it was the Democratic led senate and house that left Obama the mess. As you would say now that Obama has nothing to do with spending because he has a Republican house and senate.
            It was they who also voted for the wars. Obama just starts them without consent.
            Bush racked up 3.8 trillion in debt in 8 years and Obama has added almost 11 trillion in his 2 terms.

          • Paying to clean up the mess the GOP policies made cost billions.

          • Dem wit lemming for sure dh. Just gave yourself away beyond a doubt. Bet you voted for BO twice and are one of the freeloaders. You do realize the free ride is gonna end soon one way or the other. Trump will kick you off the spigot along with the other offenders. OR Hillary or Bernie or some other dem idiot will finish off the country. Do you think Mexico or the other third world countries have anything like SS or welfare? Dah! Not! So good luck dh.

          • I am doing just fine. Especially with my health insure stock!!! Went from $55 a share in 2010 when Obamacare started……. Today it’s over $130 a share, all due to the 20 million enrollment of Americans who can now see a dr just like you and I can.
            You know who else is doing just fine? Every corporate farm that continues to hire illegal immigrants for cheap labor and at the same time those Corp farms are receiving subsidies from the federal government…… It’s called Corp welfare.

            ps…. I don’t need ACA as my employer offers health insure.

          • No, “he dont know”, thats the problem!

            Too many like him!
            So its about a 49 percent, “educated idiots” problem!

          • Jug, I’m not sure “dh” is a he. I think it’s a tranny.

          • Rev. Walking Turtle

            Um, ‘scuse… Upvoted your post due to the perceived intent. But that really was to have been “coffers”, wasn’t it…?

            Just askin’. Not that the occasional politician’s chauffeur isn’t actually (though doubtless only occasionally) raided over some point of legality or other while on the job too, of course… And that is all. 0{;-)o[

          • LOL, you are correct…. I misspelled the word so bad that Chauffeurs was what came up in the spell checker…. Spelling is my worst ability, and I never question a spell checker… I’ll make the change…

        • I did. That, however has nothing to do with what I posted. Anyone forced to pay into a system and promised to get the benefits SHOULD get them. That also doesn’t mean I’m happy with the ROI. Anyone with a brain could have done way better. SS was originally set up for retirees who didn’t save well. If you know the history, the dumba$$oc RATS kept changing it and now, people who never paid a (Obama’s) dime into it are getting benefits. That’s why experts are saying it’ll go bankrupt in 2030, if it’s not fixed.

          • Wrong, you poor thing. You believe all the b s you hear.

            The system was set up to help your grandparents not starve and die due to greedy company owners who paid lousy wages with zero retirement benefits. Unless you worked and contributed to ss you do receive benefits. What group of folks rec benefits that do not contribute?

            Maybe if the repub controlled congress did some work they might get around to working on a jobs plan etc that would continue to strengthen ss by adding jobs!!!

          • Talk about a poor thing…. You will eat anything your ideology feeds you…

          • Again facts not jibberish work.

          • I think you hit your limit on alcohol consumption. .

          • Evidently your facts are nonexistent dh. Better go back to the reality of this administration. Old admins are being over written. BO has opened all the public funds for illegal aliens and nonvetted refugees. So sad, so sorry to inform you of your incorrect info!!

          • I am correct. ACA is doing fine and still here and Pres Obama kicked your ……. Pretty good, TWICE!! No one is listening to you but your other ignorant buddies and thank -God there aren’t enough of you to do any more harm.

          • You seem to be all jibberish. Your’re most likely on hillary’s payroll. It’s interesting that my extremely liberal friends, as well as outspoken feminists, are wondering, who exactly is voting for her. Can’t seem to find actual humans as opposed to paid trolls such as yourself.

          • Hillary’s machine counts the votes…. Nobody is actually voting for her.

            “It is enough that the people know there was an election. The people who cast the votes
            decide nothing. The people who count the votes decide everything.”
            —-Joseph Stalin

          • Well said. So true.

          • Funny all the smart folks I know are voting for the smartest most experienced person ever to run for president…… Hillary.

            Even my friends who are for sanders are moving over to Hillary as none of us want a dangerous racist bigot named trump in our White House.

          • Michael Dennewitz

            dh, yo momma have any kids that lived???

          • apparently NOT!LOL

          • dh – You wouldn’t know a fact if it bit you in your arse, afterall, you’re a flaming liberal that gets their news from the MSM. You should try naming or proving one single thing your indoctrination has erroneously convinced you of being factual. I mean, Hillarious had to duck down by being under sniper fire in Bosnia/Kosovo, Whitewater and the list goes on and on. How about her being fired as being the most corrupt lawyer while being on the team that was investigating the Nixon trials, and she was fired from a top democratic special prosecutor.

          • And she is going to kick trumps’s …. And you all know it!!

          • Money in the gummint coffer is fungible. Do you know what that means? SS benefits are being transferred to Oblablabla’s fellow muslims he’s bringing in as well as thousands from south of the border. Would you be so kind as to tell us where you learned your socialist propaganda? Look into the recent immigrants receiving benefits, you may be surprised.

          • SS benefits are collected by folks who worked for those benefits. I am not surprised by anything you ignorant folks come up with. Thank God there aren’t enough of you left to do any more harm.

            i learned about my wonderful benefits when I started working at my company 38 years ago when they started taking out ss. When I was ready to retiree I went on ss.gov and saw my benefit info. I am sure you are collecting yours, unless you are an illegal immigrant!!!

            Illegal immigrants do not rec benefits. Illegals do get paid by greedy employers under the table who want cheap labor. Go scream at them, or is that you?

          • It takes a real moron to add their own spin (as the duma$$oc RATS call their lies) or ,as I call it, a lie, to someone else’s post. Reread mine. I never mentioned illegal immigrants. In Minnesota, there are many Kenyan muslims that receive gummint benefits. Don’t you know? Or are you ignorant of these facts also? Do you want to know the others? Look it up. I did. Usually Libturds don’t care to find the truth. Socialist propaganda works just fine for those IDIOTS.

          • Pres Reagan signed the law into effect in the 80’s giving ANYONE benefits in any ER in this USA. If the Muslims are citizens just like Italians, poles, etc that came to this country they rec benefits. Indians are the only real Americans.

          • It takes months, for some years , to become a citizen. Only ignorant fools and liars do not admit that new immigrants get benefits. I think you are both. You’ve proved it, now go away and stop bothering me with your lies. Get an education from someone responsible.

          • Facts are important, you have nothing but name calling. That’s why your party continues to lose the presidency. Trump is following the same name calling zero substance pattern. Hillary is the smartest most experienced person ever to run for president and she is following the man who saved this country from the mess he was handed by bush and lying Cheney on 1/20/09.

          • Look, you dim wit. It was you who started with the name calling, not I.That’s a typical dumba$$oc RAT tactic. You are a RACIST, and a LIAR. Hellary is a Liar and a thief. Do you have any idea what she did to the women who HillBilly molested, what she stole from the white house, or how she traded US interests for her personal gain? How could a person of good character look the loved ones of fallen US agents in the face and LIE to them? Everything Oblablabla has done has proven to be a pathetic failure. From Green Energy (now bankrupt to the sum of ~$850 million, to the health care roll out (same total to Mooch hells friends) ,foreign policy (helping to set up the muslim brotherhood ) an economy growing at 1%, food stamps up ~40%, poverty up workforce participation down and embedded terrorists crossing our borders. I could go on and on but I’m tired of dealing with a LIAR who distorts what few facts they have to attempt to make LYING DUMBA$$O CRATS look good (ain’t working). If you knew anything about economics or personal responsibility you’d get your news from some other source than NBC or The Defender. As you’ve proven yourself to be a lying POS , I prefer not to deal with you. You only justify your opinions with lies then claim you have facts. Now GO AWAY. You F’n LIAR.

          • Too many facts for you I see. Obama saved your ……. From the disaster he was handed by bush and lying Cheney on 1/20/09. This country would look like Greece right about now had we contained the GOP failed policies and you all know it. The American people (with brains) also know it as they RE-ELECTED Obama for saving us.

            Not fn going away!!! Loser!!!

          • Not facts for you dh. Don’t know where you research but not in reality for certain.

          • Takes some work to understand the laws and the new edicts of this POS prez. Good posts though for you kbmiller. You do know your stuff.

          • Thanks SD, seems like “dh” and “Reality Check” are a couple lying idiots trying to push their minority racist opinions. Neither are man enough to admit an error. Probly both transgendered and confused.

          • Wrong again dh. Better do your research. Not too hip on accounting and regs are you?

          • You are pretty sad and now I see pretty ignorant.

          • Right again kbmiller.

          • You R so right KB. But just take a look at all the freebies they give the illegal immigrants, housing vouchers, food, free medical care and much more. Look at how many free flights whisking the border crosser’s off to various locations and states unknown. Even buying a 300 room hotel to house some of them in when they had no relatives to live with. Look at all the Air Force bases that were forced to take thousands of them in and care for them.

          • No, you are wrong dh. The investment had it been made would have netted far more income for the SS folks. kdmiller is quite correct. But you are right about why it was created. Take it from a financial person of which I am one, the mismanagement of those funds has been phenominal. And your assumptions about the republicans has some validity considering the rinos who are the same as dem lemmings. They are with the NWO crowd and consistently for destroying the middle class base of this country by either importing foreign labor in their HB visa programs or sending the work off shore in the trade agreements or just opening our borders as in the EU and flooding us with welfare bound illegal alien hordes or nonvetted refugees who will soon put this country into revolution if not stopped..

          • What group of folks rec benefits that do not contribute?”
            There are over 30,000 Illegals who have never payed into and are not old enough to collect S.S. benefits who receive benefits every month. and that is just in Colorado.

          • Wrong…prove it.

          • Government numbers right from DOLE and GAO. The state has even admitted to the abuse and claimed the numbers are quite possibly on the low side. Perhaps you should follow the reports from the state agencies and pursue the truth instead of listening to the MSM lies.

          • Again, prove it with the web site showing your numbers!!!!!! Anyone can throw out initials. Do you even know what they stand for? There are zero immigrants rec ss benefits. Yes, we are feeding folks and providing shelter or this would be Auschwitz.

          • Fox News/newsmax/numbersusa are all right wing rags and if you read all of the wash post article you would realize the center for Medicare& Medicaid services DISPUTE the senators claims. They aren’t FACTS they are claims.

            I only deal with facts, buddy, move along, you lost.

          • back it up loser
            you run off at the mouth but provide NO truths or facts
            because you have none
            so put simply
            PUT UP OR SHUT UP because you lost before you ever started. Don’t bother with any more of your childish retorts unless you can back them up with facts. Which you can’t.

          • Actually, the system was set up in early 1930’s and they selected 65 years of age as less than 10% of the people lived beyond that age. It was set up to supplement the few surviving, not provide for retirement.

          • wrong again ignorant troll. stfu if you have nothing to say-which you don’t

          • Kicked your ….. TWICE!!!

          • hardly loser libbie..go play in traffic now, you used your 2 cents worth.

          • Obozo’s Muslim refugees and Mexican immigrants are getting all the medical, food stamps and money from us, the U.S. citizens that paid into SS all these years and we still have to pay for medical, buy our own food and work a part-time job into our 70’s because obozo is giving it all away.

          • Obviously you did not save or work. If you worked and saved and your job had a pension (98% did) I am sure you are just fine like the rest if us who retired in the last 5-10 years.

            You always had to pay a portion of your medical and buy your own food when you retired. What the heck are you talking about?!!!

            Refugees and immigrants are getting nothing more than the law former President Reagan signed into effect back in the 80’s when he let in a lot more immigrants then Pres Obama ever has.

            Maybe the Indians should have kicked your relatives back across the ocean!! You racist bigot.

        • “my room mate Mary Is getting paid on the internet 98$/hr”…..!jk437etwo days ago grey MacLaren P1 I bought after earning 18,512 Dollars..it was my previous month’s payout..just a little over.17k Dollars Last month..3-5 hours job a day…with weekly payouts..it’s realy the simplest. job I have ever Do.. I Joined This 7 months. ago. and now making over. hourly 87 Dollars…Learn. More right Here !jk437e:➽:➽:➽➽➽➽ http://GlobalSuperJobsReportsEmploymentsHelpfulGetPay-Hour$98…. .✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸::::::!jk437e….,……

        • Americans Wake Up

          Why wouldn’t I take it? I paid into it for 50 years and am getting a small percentage of what I could have had if FDR had let us invest it ourselves. I guess you will pass on yours and give it to and illegal alien that does not deserve it let alone be in our country.

          • You mean like bush /GOP policies wanted to invest SS into the market right before the market crashed in 2008-09?!!!!!!! Thank God McCain lost!! Or you would have zero!!

      • Boy!!!!! You damb sure hit the nail on the head, plus what about the medical care that congress has given themselves. Our gov. is self serving to the nth….

        • hey fool, congress uses the same “exchanges” that everyone else does.

          • Americans Wake Up

            And voted to give themselves subsidies so they don’t have to pay for it.

          • They did not need subsides, all federal government employees have had health insure offered to them for over 40 years. They also have always had a portion of their premium paid over 40 years just like any other employer does, like GE or Fox News or a state employee or city employee all across this country.

          • God your a fool.
            congress has ALWAYS gotten FREE HC and benefits.
            you just wake up from a 60 year coma?

          • It’s not free. The federal worker does contribute to their health plan premium.

          • IF Diane had a working brain, she would realize that the conversation was about “Congress”.

          • Congress folks are federal employees….. Looks like reality needs a check.

          • but all federal employee’s are “Congress”, silly Diane.

          • billdeserthills

            Let us not forget the raises they like to vote for themselves

          • Chris Robinette

            No they don’t.

          • Congress along with the very other federal employee has had health insurance coverage called FEP (federal employee plan) for over 40 years. They have more than 30 health insure can choose from. Every year in November they are able to change to another plan just like someone who works for a company that provides health insure. They also have had a portion of their premium paid over the last 40 years just like so one who works for example GE or a state employee or police or firemen. They did not need ACA just like many in America who worked for a company did not need health insure.

            You can go on-line to FEP.gov to see the plans.

          • it’s scary that you fools actually think you’re informed.

            “So many people have said Congress is exempt from Obamacare that in September 2013, PolitiFact National made the claim, rated False, one of its top 16 myths about the health care law.

            For many years, members of Congress chose from a variety of insurance plans offered by the Federal Employees Health Benefits Program, which serves 8 million federal and retired workers and their dependents.

            So, members of Congress were like most Americans, covered through their employer with the employer picking up most of the tab.

            That will end in January 2014, when lawmakers and some of their staff will be required under the health care law to pick from plans in the health care law’s new marketplaces. They are the only Americans facing this requirement, although Uncle Sam will still continue to pick up most of the cost.”

            http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin/statements/2013/oct/21/sean-duffy/obamacare-congress-must-buy-insurance-marketplaces/

            don’t like that link?
            PROVIDE ONE THAT SAYS DIFFERENT, low info idiot of the right.

            http://healthaffairs.org/blog/2013/10/01/implementing-health-reform-congressional-coverage-multi-state-plan-program-and-aca-litigation-with-a-twist/

          • Chris Robinette

            From dh 2 hours ago for you Reality check blinded by all the trees.

            Congress along with the very other federal employee has had health insurance coverage called FEP (federal employee plan) for over 40 years. They have more than 30 health insure can choose from. Every year in November they are able to change to another plan just like someone who works for a company that provides health insure. They also have had a portion of their premium paid over the last 40 years just like so one who works for example GE or a state employee or police or firemen. They did not need ACA just like many in America who worked for a company did not need health insure.

            You can go on-line to FEP.gov to see the plans.

          • the liberal post TWO links.
            the cons posts a broken link and Flaps it’s Gums.

            FACTS versus HOT AIR.

          • Chris Robinette

            I knew it, democrap all the way aren’t you? bye, you are worthless.

          • only one of us is Flapping their Gums.
            only one of us posting LINKS to prove what they say.

          • Chris Robinette

            reality check, did you just fart in the woods?

          • How about this link?:http://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2014/11/10/obamacare-architect-yeah-we-lied-to-the-stupid-american-people-n1916605

            There are others, but they all report the same thing. Exactly how many do you need to read before you get a clue?

          • only the low info right wing cite Townhall.

          • That certainly explains why it’s on the low-info left wing sites, too, huh? A “cite” is short for “citation”. A “site” is a location. Also, when you’re going to come on here and call people stupid, it’s “you’re stupid” (the abbreviated form of you are)-not “your stupid”. Also, it’s not “you not just an idiot”-it’s “you’re not just an idiot”. Please tell your friend, dh, that there’s no such thing as “health insure”. The word “insure” is a verb, not a noun. Shall I continue? One thing is certain…Gruber is absolutely right.

          • zzzzzzzzzzzz

          • Snicker. Your snoozing instead of paying attention speaks volumes as to your position.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Your position is your face stuffed in pillow and your booty up in the air to catch conservative thoughts and digest the only way you know how.

          • Is that supposed to insult me? You just made a fool of yourself. Keep it up.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            God no! It was a compliment!

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Oh yes, don’t swallow, or you’ll get pregnant, even if your man.

          • It’s “you’re” a man-not “your” man. You’re looking even more foolish now.

          • Folks with a brain got my point……health insure/health insurance…… It’s called abbreviation.

          • That’s rather my point. Folks with a brain understood that you didn’t care enough about your comments to take the time to communicate properly. Rather than improve your own communications, you expect others to simply overlook it. Take responsibility for yourself and stop expecting others to give you a pass. The reason you can’t communicate is because you’ve been given passes on matters such as these. No-“insure” is not an abbreviated version of “insurance”.

          • As I said the folks with a brain got my point……. Obviously that was not you.

          • Everyone knew your point. Still, you want to make excuses for being lazy and refusing to improve yourself. That’s what makes you a loyal liberal-everyone else is expected to make concessions for you.

          • The more important point is ACA insure is allowing millions of our fellow Americans the ability to see a dr, thank God.

          • The point is that ACA rations healthcare. Don’t worship socialism and thank God. It offends Him.

          • Obviously you have no idea what you are talking about. ACA is for folks who do not have health insure thru their employer. If you have insurance thru your employer you cannot sign-up for ACA…..YOU DONT NEED IT!!!!!!

            Nothing is rationed unless you live in a red state and your brainless governor did not do a state exchange or expand Medicaid.

          • Premiums through employers have more than doubled in most cases. Their plan is to make it so expensive that all have to join Obamacare and submit to government control. Yep-those with insurance, which isn’t free by the way, are paying for others. Hey, we even get to cover pregnancies for men. It’s all rationed, but you simply choose to ignore that. Believe what you want, but the truth is still the truth. Don’t get cancer-you only get 1/2 of the chemo treatments that are necessary.

          • The screwy benefits you described only happen sadly in red states where the governs are missing portions of their brains. They did not do a state exchange or expand Medicaid, but red states made sure they also pay for viagra and cialis but screw you on chemo.

            First of all my governor did a ACA state exchange which means there are 5-25 insurance companies folks who need insur can chose from. My employer/ Fortune 500 company did not stop offering health insur as an option so I don’t need ACA. Just like 80% of Americans who work for large companies. The options on state exchanges are your choice every year so if you need 100% chemo coverage you CHOSE that insurance company.

            Sorry your state is so backwards….. Move.

          • Everything you wrote is a big fat lie. Enough with the desperation.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            You’re just flat out stupid. I hope you’re so stupid it’s not awkward for you to go out in public.

          • It’s clear that you’re qualified to determine who is and who is not stupid.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Thank you, Yes, it is quite true I am the best person here to determine who and who isn’t stupid. In you’re case, you’re intelligence is less than that of an abortion’s.

          • The gov’t workers have more doctor’s to choose from that your average Joe. I went on this site and I put a doctor’s name in that I see nope the doctor wasn’t listed but when I searched for same doctor under the same plan as a gov’t employee low and behold the doctor was listed.

          • Employer based health insurance plans always had more leverage in putting together packages, which includes provider networks for their employees. The federal gov’t is no different.

            With all the crap repubs tried to screw ACA with they were lucky to have any networks at all. The most important part is Americans who had zero health insurance can now see a dr in the ofc or not go bankrupt because of a $40,000 I/p hospital bill.

            I am sure you have health insurance.

          • I am sure you are aware that the minimum someone would have to pay for the hospital bill you mentioned is $4,000 and that is with a platinum plan. None of the plans offered on the exchanges pay 100% once deductible is made. It ranges from 10-40% the insured is responsible for.

          • Your example is if you live in a red state and your governor did not do a state exchange or expand Medicaid. Red state folks have 4 options, gold, silver, platinum,? ( forgot name). And yes, each one of those options has an upfront deductiable. Go scream at your governor who screwed you by not doing a state exchange!!!!!!!

            In states that have a state exchange there are 5-25 health insurance companies to chose from. You as the consumer can decide which plan’s premium and benefits works best for your family Some of those plans DO NOT even have a a upfront deductiable. Some only have upfront copays (called HMO’s) and some do have upfront deductiables. Again, with a state exchange you have more than 4 options. That means your $40,000 hosp bill could be paid infull based on the discounted rate that insur company negotiated with the providers.

          • And you are a liar also. Even an idiot like you can see they have other options that we pay for.

          • You are a f*cking idiot. Your great WSJ just shed a little light on the problem and you are still defending this doomed plan. You have definitely drank too much of the kool-aid.

          • so a link was too challenging for the moron of the right wing?

          • StupidConservativeValues

            You’re whole existence is based on misinformation and superstition. Loser.

          • Only a few of them! Just to show the electorate they are one of them.

          • Honestly, you truly appear to become more ignorant every time you post something. Do you really think that the lawmakers are subject to the same medical care that most Americans are ?

          • Most Americans are covered by insure thru their employer. All federal employees, which includes congress and all presidents since the 60’s have had health insure offered by their employer, which is the federal government. They have at least 30 health insure company options to choose from in every state plus the federal govt has paid a portion of their premium also since the 60’s.

          • dh – You talk about ignorant, the fact (most likely a lie) that you were going to retire at 38 years old. You show your ignorance once again, by referring to health insurance companies as “health insure companies”. Where did you learn spelling or grammar from, a Cracker Jack Box ?

          • Folks with a brain understood abbreviation.

          • I said I started working for my company 38 years ago……. Comprehension helps, get some!!!!

          • StupidConservativeValues

            He learned it from your mommy.

          • God you cons are dumbass meat sacks.

            “So many people have said Congress is exempt from Obamacare that in September 2013, PolitiFact National made the claim, rated False, one of its top 16 myths about the health care law.

            For many years, members of Congress chose from a variety of insurance plans offered by the Federal Employees Health Benefits Program, which serves 8 million federal and retired workers and their dependents.

            So, members of Congress were like most Americans, covered through their employer with the employer picking up most of the tab.

            That will end in January 2014, when lawmakers and some of their staff will be required under the health care law to pick from plans in the health care law’s new marketplaces. They are the only Americans facing this requirement, although Uncle Sam will still continue to pick up most of the cost.”

            http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin/statements/2013/oct/21/sean-duffy/obamacare-congress-must-buy-insurance-marketplaces/

            don’t like that link?
            PROVIDE ONE THAT SAYS DIFFERENT, low info idiot of the right.

            http://healthaffairs.org/blog/2013/10/01/implementing-health-reform-congressional-coverage-multi-state-plan-program-and-aca-litigation-with-a-twist/

          • Michael Dennewitz

            NOT THIS ASSHOLE AGAIN!? Where’s the rest of your TROLL buddies, asswipe??

          • Reality Check is a reality check for conservatives to remind us why we are conservative.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Why, because you have memory loss. We have to remind you not to fuck up the country…again!

          • Since you have nothing of value to add, just type to the screen. Don’t expect anyone, including myself, to read anymore of your comments. Maybe you should sober up first, though.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Oh damn, I was hoping you would keep reading them!!!!

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Right here you fucking fool.

          • Michael Dennewitz

            HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
            BLAHBLAHBLAHBLAH

          • and can opt out. Just like you.HA HA

          • You are full of sh*t

          • the FACTS are right below, idiot of the right wing.

            reading TOO HARD?

          • well moron,
            except for the fact that I proved IT.

          • billdeserthills

            Has anyone told you that You are an Idiot!??!

          • Wow, you are really stupid !!!!! And I guess you also believe they “brown bag” their lunches and drive themselves to work too.

          • I provided links, moron of the right.
            what do you supply?

            FLAPPING GUMS.
            the difference between the two groups.

            FACTS versus HOT AIR

        • So very true, very true! Just about all of them are a bunch of crooks The good ones that do get elected they either learn to accept and play their way or they leave rather than continue trtpying to work with that mess. It is a HUGE mass of
          Red Tape now where the right hand does not know what the left hand is doing.
          They admit spending a great deal of their time trying to raise money to get re-elected and not reading the bills. In other words not doing the job they elected to do are are paid to do.

        • Richard Trundle

          WHAT ABOUT THE FREE MEDICAL CARE OBAMA IS GIVING THE REFUGEES AND TERRORIST…………HUH

        • StupidConservativeValues

          Actually, he hit his thumb and not the nail on the head as you falsely proclaim.

        • Contact the Trump campaign and make sure that the things Congress gets that we don’t needs to be addressed now. That would help him pick up more supporters.

      • “Did you ever see what the actual math shows one would have accrued if they’d invested their money in the stock market”

        you seem to be unable to post that info.
        why not?

        you a fool?

        • Are you too lazy to look it up yourself Reality or should I do it for you? It would take about 90secs or less on Google. Do you need help?

        • You think you’re slick. Wait until the market is down, then cite the obvious. Do your own math. Your results will always be skewed. The stock market has and will continue to come back. SS might not. SS was never supposed to be an investment scheme. I don’t care for it, but people have invested money in it for retirement purposes. That money has been abused by government management. If SS should fail, liberal thinkers like you should be held responsible for getting people their money back.

          • “You think you’re slick”
            no, just smarter than KBmiller and you based on THAT post.

          • Nope. You are just displaying your ignorance for the liberals like you have been doing for quite awhile. No smarts there.

        • Look you F’n blue gum, individual people would invest differently. Since you call everyone else on here a “fool”, look it up yourself. I’ll help you, because you seem like an idiot. Average stock market, return on investment versus SS , ROI. Are you bright enough to look it up? After you’ve struggled with it for a few days, re post me and tell me what you found out, if you’re man enough, I doubt it though. Probly a Transgendered hermaphrodite. You imbecile.

          • anyone living off income from the stock market would have been in food lines in jan 2008, silly fool of the right wing.

          • Guess what, Mumbo Jumbo, I lost about 35% of my investments. I’m still better off than if it’d all been in SS type returns. How ignant (Sharpton) are you? You are just too stupid to figure it all out, aren’t you?Try getting an education in a worthwhile major and work 5 or 6 days a week for 40 years, like most American patriotic tax payers., instead of collecting welfare till you’re blue in the gums.

      • If Oblowhard and his sycophants had just come out and said they wanted give blacks and illegals free health care without destroying the entire system that would have at least been the truth. But he knew if he did that there would have been a revolution. Wasn’t it United Health Care, the largest provider that has announced they will be dropping participation with OvomitCare? And as you said every state that started exchanges has been bankrupted by them. And Oblowhard is paying all the insurance companies for their losses, behind the publics back. That alone will cost a trillion or two each year.

        • Yep !! the RACIST in the white house knew the lamestream media and low information Dumba$$oc RATS wouldn’t call him a RACIST even after pushing such an obscenely RACIST program. They don’t care how much of “Other People’s Money” it costs, since they aren’t paying.

          • You are so ignorant.

          • d (ick) h(ead) your boy Sharpton spells it “Ignant”. Why don’t you? Did you look up the SS return on investment , yet? HA HA HA HA w’as matta, ‘fraid ta? That’s Oblablabla’s spelling of the word “to” . HA HA HA Get yo sef an edumacashun you $hit for brained cockroach.

          • Name calling and swearing. Are you about 13?

        • ACA is doing just fine in states where governors had a brain and did a state exchange and expanded Medicaid. UnitedHealth only enrolled 6% of the 12 million enrolled ACA members. They are also only in a few exchanges so dropping out causes little disruption. Anthem is the largest insurance carrier in the state exchanges and they have enrolled so many folks their stock went from $55 a share in 2010 (eff date of ACA) to $130 plus a share today!!!

          ACA is here to stay and millions of Americans can now see a dr. I bet you have health insurance.

    • Social security is already bankrupt. All the money is gone, spent on other things. You pay for Medicare while working, pay premiums straight out or social security check, and you pay for supplemental insurance.

      • The Premium that comes out of your social security check is for part B of Medicare. (Dr charges). Part A of Medicare (hosp charges) is free if you worked enough quarters in your lifetime.

    • Millions more Americans are now suffering now that the lies of 0bamacare are evident. 0bama cheapened himself and the presidency to below a used car salesman when it came to 0bamacare…

      The system as it was, before 0bamacare, is and always was better than 0bamacare. That should have been our FIRST alternative… To leave things the way they were.

      But Nooooo, liberals lied and created a crisis of which they could not waste… Everybody in America was played the fool. Including you.

      • You do realize Obamacare is patterned after a conservative Heritage Foundation program, right?!!! Infact Romney used the same blue print for romneycare in Massachusetts. President Obama then used a combination of both republican idea’s to get buy in from republicans on ACA. But noooooooooo, and now they have been trying to screw their own idea, 61 times!!!!

        • I don’t CARE who it was patterned off of. It is a total looser, and was sold on a stack of lies and deception.

          Romney, and 0bama are liberal progressives, it is hard to tell the difference if you close your eyes.. Both parties are controlled by liberal progressives. The liberal progressives in the republican party are just liberals in conservative clothing…

          Republican elites could have stopped 0bamacare if they were true to our wishes, but nooooo, they betrayed us and bungled things up at just the opportune time for the liberals that control everything.

          Those 61 times was a ruse and never stood a chance of actually doing anything…

          Time for a change…. Time for term limits.. Time for some honesty in our politicians.

          • Also time for your fellow Americans to not die because they could not see a dr.

          • They didn’t, only fools believe that lie….

          • You have no idea how many Americans died because they could not go to a dr early in an illness or could not afford blood pressure meds or had to cut their meds in half or did not get a flu shot or could not afford asthma medication or did not know they had high cholesterol or did not know they has diabetes.

          • There you ya go… Everybody that died of high blood pressure died because they were not on 0bamacare…. No kidding???? Suppose nobody died in Canada for the same reason? What was their excuse???

            More lies…. Do you always have this much trouble assessing information?

          • you have no idea how many Americans have died due to lack of health care

          • You have no idea how many Americans have died due to the lack of health care either…..

            But, there you go claiming all these people are dying because of high blood pressure or lack of insurance…

            Or perhaps they died just so you could pad your stats…. You are an evil person.

          • Since I worked in the healthcare field, I do have some idea. Facts are hard for you folk.
            Don’t worry, no one needs you all and thank goodness there aren’t enough of you to screw up everything again.

          • Since you are an uber ideologue, you will twist your truth to suit the outcome you want. You probably sold insurance…. That would explain a lot.

          • It would explain my facts….. You have zero facts just name calling.

          • It would explain your greed, your abusive use of lies as well. Profiting from misleading others is just evil.

          • I am very happy my fellow Americans who did not work for an employer like I did who offered health insure or aged off of their parents plan or had a pre-existing condition or maxed out their health benefits due to thousands of $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ in chemo treatments or newborns who spend months in nic units costing $250,000 plus etc etc etc etc can now get health insurance coverage.

            You might want to talk to some of those folks who can now see a dr or know they won’t go bankrupt due to medical bills….. They are pretty happy. That’s called FACTS.

          • Why are you happy, because you made someone else pay for it?

          • Anyone on ACA pays a premium.

          • All are forced to pay something,,,,, That is not America, the land of the free.

          • Americans Wake Up

            You have no idea how many vets have died due to lack of good healthcare in the government run VA system.

          • And that is due to republican/GOP budget cuts. The dr’s at the VA’s should be paid what wall st has stolen from us but the repub house/GOP wants less government. That means budget cuts. That means less dr’s, less appointments etc. same issue at the airports. Cut budgets and pay, less tsa agents which means long lines. Same with every branch of government. Cut everything then complain nothing works.

          • what a moron… And I thought you had a brain of your own…. There I go giving a troll too much credit again.

          • hah! and YOU do? hell no you don’t-you have no idea what you are even talking about- much less have any real FACTS to support your liberally spoon-fed obamacare propaganda talking points either you liberal tool. your ignorance is all ya got, so go on back to the bar and espouse your buddy obozo to the rest of the drunks with nothing better to do.

          • Facts sure scared you!!

          • not really, as you haven’t supplied any troll-boy try again

          • I see zero facts from you just b s name calling.

            Do you have health insurance? If so why are you so against your fellow Americas doing the same thing……. Having the ability to see a dr I thought you people were so Christian ?

          • LOL the name calling is well deserved you know nothing little troll.

          • Why are you against your fellow Americans seeing a dr, just like you can?

          • That’s what the liberals who support the plan want. Pay attention! Look at the VA for examples.

          • What is it with you people? You have health insurance, you can see a dr!!!! Why don’t you want your fellow Americans to be able to see a dr? I thought you people were so Christian. You are all fakes and ugly Americans.

            The VA like all fed agencies are being budgeted out of business by the repub house. Defund our embassies security/Benghazi……defund EPA/flint, mich…..defund TSA/long lines…..etc etc etc etc….then complain the government doesn’t work. We can see you!!!!!!!

          • Who said I don’t want anyone seeing a doctor? The plan that one proposed isn’t helping people; it’s bringing the government in to control everything. Anyone who has dealt with that KNOWS it’s a bad idea. Military people and veterans know that government control is NOT what is wanted in health care.

            If you think that’s how things work, you aren’t looking closely enough.

    • Americans Wake Up

      Medicare is unsustainable and is bankrupting the fed. Social security has been ravaged by illegals and the freeloaders that get SSD and are able bodied to work plus the Fed has raided it to fund other socialist programs.
      The socialist programs of FDR, Johnson and Obama are making the US of A a third world country.

      • so the 2.7 billion trust fund is gutted?

        that kind of proves your not the best informed.

        • Americans Wake Up

          Yes it has been. Full of IOU’s. Your the uninformed or do you just believe what the government tells you? Why do you think it will busted by the new date of 2022. The Ponzi scheme has ran out of other peoples money.

          • the pentagon has “lost” 8 Trillion.

            if we can absorb THAT loss, we can fix SS easy.

            just start less wars.

            “With $8.5 Trillion Unaccounted for, Why Should Congress Increase the
            Defense Budget?”

            The U.S. military is good at fighting wars, but it sucks at managing
            money. Partly because of its convoluted bookkeeping systems, $8.5
            trillion—yes, trillion—taxpayer dollars doled out by Congress
            since 1996 has never been accounted for.”

            http://www.thefiscaltimes.com/2015/03/19/85-Trillion-Unaccounted-Should-Congress-Increase-Defense-Budget

            funny how I never hear the RIGHT mention THIS waste of money.

    • .You are a fool the cost is massive Nothing in it works Millions insured versus Trillions in Debt DO the Math. They could have given single payer or Universal for less $ You could not keep your doctor or your plan you can’t even move out of state Social Security is not the same it is pre-paid You put nothing in you get nothing out. You also pay for Medicare too even in retirement about 1500 a year
      .

      • so Ken the ill informed.
        the national debt has NOTHING to do with SS.

        • See how stupid you are I wasn’t talking about the National Debt it is the cost of the program the botched roll out the failure of the exchanges the bailouts of Insurance company losses. You never passed math that is sure

          • “the bailouts of Insurance company losses”

            when did HC companies get bailed out?

            you just pull shit from your ass and pretend its not smelly?

          • Kenneth Fichtl

            Obama just got nailed for giving money to Insurance companies from the ACA slush fund. Not only do you not know the past but you forgot the present. United is pulling out for it is losing money.The States clearing house loses are in the Billions. You are a Mullet Colorado is developing it’s own coverage. You must be from NYC that is where all the Nimrods Live.

          • United only has 6% of the 12 million enrolled ACA subscribers. Their pulling out in the few states they are in really has very little impact. The state’s are not losing billions. As a matter of fact Anthem blue cross has gained so much enrollment (which equals premiums!!) their stock went from $55 a share in 2010 to over $130 a share as of last week.

          • “Obama just got nailed for giving money to Insurance companies from the ACA slush fund”

            to pay poor people premiums FOOL, not bail out the insurance companies.

            why are you such an idiot while pretending to be informed?

          • “United is pulling out for it is losing money”

            if they didn’t pay their CEO 60 million a year, probably wouldn’t have to.

            beside FOOL, they said MAYBE.
            “While its Obamacare business weighed on UnitedHealth’s fourth-quarter
            results, it still had a profitable year thanks to its other operations.
            The insurer earned $5.8 billion in 2015, up from $5.6 billion a year
            earlier.

            only 5 BILLION in profits from SICK PEOPLE with no other option.

            soon there will be laws against THAT.

          • he is pretty lame on reading as well! typical liberal tool-just name-calls and expects YOU to provide him with the truth so he can shoot it down-no matter what the subject is-a nasty little troll is RC.

          • Kenneth Fichtl

            This type is getting really old. I stay to facts That’s is what I did all my life. I don’t lie well.

          • You have zero facts.

          • I guess you missed out on the year long disaster of the roll out of bush’s Medicare D rx plan for seniors! What a mess!!! However unlike the 61 times the repubs have wasted millions of our tax $$$$$$$$$$$$$ repealing ACA the democrates gathered the repubs and said we will help you correct the issues with your plan and go back to our states and explain it…….. Which they did and Medicare D is running just fine. ( although bush never budgeted for medicare d, just like the wars, Medicare d is part of our $20 billion debt)

        • Americans Wake Up

          The national debt has everything to do with the programs and wars that every president and put in place. Our economy took a dive when welfare was introduced and the abuses of it continue to drain it. Obama and Bush 2 pushed 14 trillion of new debt on the US and the taxes collected are barely making interest payments. We borrow money from China and give it to our enemies on a regular basis. Time to hit the stop button and trim the federal government down, push the costs of infrastructure back to the states and get rid of wasteful government spending like benefits and pay for life for the Congress and president and studying the sex of a snail.

          • well low info human, without the GOP, the US would have a TINY national debt.
            why don’t you Americans WAKE THE FUCK UP?

            So lets examine the Debt for the low info con, shall we?

            Reagan was the first to TRIPLE the national debt.
            then Bush One DOUBLED the national debt YET AGAIN.

            then Clinton did a little damage and even left GW a SURPLUS.

            then Bush TWO added 76% MORE to the debt
            WHILE
            giving out a 1.7 TRILLION tax cut (now part of the debt)
            starting
            TWO wars that Obama had to pay for
            AND
            pushing through the Big Pharma bonus of ONE TRILLION
            in unpaid for bills that Obama had to pay for.

            Bush also gets credit for the first 1.4 trillion on Obama’ tab since that was a
            GW Bush administration budget AND the RECESSION that cut tax revenues
            ADDING to the Debt.

            so low info con, without the GOP we would have a very small national debt.

          • EXCELLENT FACTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Thank-you.

      • “They could have given single payer or Universal for less”

        ya but the FOOLS of the GOP wouldn’t have that, now would they?
        are we on the same planet?

        • The GOP did not pass ACA it was Passed without reading Remember Nancy Pelosi?

          • Americans Wake Up

            There were no GOP votes for it.

          • No one ever got to read the bill. Of course the GOP didn’t vote for it It is failing everyday.

          • The prez even used the GOP heritage conservative plan to try and get buy in from the GOP (same plan Romney used for Romney care) they still said no. So the Pres and ms Pelosi said then we are going to help Americans see a dr and you can read your old plan after we pass it as people are dying.

          • no fool I don’t remember, since THAT is not what happened.
            why don’t you link me to that story and we will read how ignorant you are, together?

      • “you can’t even move out of state”

        are you mentally challenged?

        • If you move from one state to another your ACA does not go with you

          • so your problem is punctuation?

            wow, that is sad.

            your health insurance changed when you went state to state BEFORE, MORON of the right wing.

            geez, how do you people dress and feed yourselves if you’re this OUT OF TOUCH with reality?

          • Kenneth Fichtl

            Not true I had United used the same insurance in Arizona Colorado and Oregon.

          • every state has different regulations, idiot of the right wing.

          • All you need to do is go on line and change your address and you can enroll in the ACA option in that state.

          • Kenneth Fichtl

            I already have more insurance than my son and I need. I was Corporate Thanks anyway

          • Then you aren’t even on ACA.

            You indicated ACA could not be used in other states. I was correcting your statement. ACA can be used in other states.

        • You must be a progressive Democrat that failed toilet training

    • Stated like a true fool.

    • We paid into social security and Medicare! But then they included many who did not pay into it and they, the government, mis-managed the funds.

    • Millions more would like to say NO THANK YOU Many suggestions have been offered, Medical savings accounts, Cross state competition, tort reform but your “bipartisan” President will have none of it.

      • Zero has been offered in detail. Bullet points is not a comprehensive plan. Obviously you also don’t know ACA was patterned after a plan developed by the conservative Heritage Foundation. It’s also what Romney used to develop romneycare for Massachusetts.

        Repubs have offered zero.

        • Is that the only thing that liberals do when something they enacted fails, blame someone else. Bullet points are where you start or are you like Pelosi “we need to pass it to read it”

          • The true Pelosie story:
            The president said in 2009 let us dems and repubs sit down together and work on comprehensive health care for those who don’t have it……..repub said no.

            Then the Pres said well what if we patterned the plan after your conservative heritage plan that Romney used for romneycare?……… Repubs said no

            Then Pelosie said well then if you all won’t work with us we are going to work on a plan to allow your fellow Americans to see a dr just like you can……. “You can read it when we pass it since you do not want to be involved”

        • Is that the only thing that liberals do when something they enacted fails, blame someone else. Bullet points are where you start

          or are you like Pelosi “we need to pass it to read it”

    • The alternative was the system we already had, which was known to be one of the best systems in any developed nation. Now what we have is a total farce costing twice as much and providing half the coverage, much more akin to a third world nation run by a FASCIST DICTATOR. Even by the governments own account we now have more Americans without insurance then 30 years ago. Many simply can NOT afford Obamanation careless.
      Ask me I know My plan is over $800 per month and has a $8000 deductible, and I get no assistance. So if I get sick i pay the first $8000 plus nearly $10,000 per year. All so i would not be considered in violation of a law passed by a criminal Dictator. Repeal this Criminal CRAP and prosecute the criminal in chief POS and return the rights of the people to We The People.

      • We had a lousy system prior to ACA. Insure companies could deny coverage, could canc coverage, could change benefits without notice etc. if you did not have the luxury of getting insure thru your employer you had zero leverage if you met your max payout or maybe had a pre-existing condition like cancer or even pregnancy. You had zero rights. Now you do.

        • Americans Wake Up

          All the above could have been fixed in a 6 line bill instead of a 20,000 page monster no one has read.
          1) portability
          2) open markets across state lines
          3) no pre-existing conditions
          4) no caps on coverage
          5) insurance pools for those who didn’t work to maximize costs and coverage
          6) no cancellations due to treatments for disease or accidents
          But the ACA isn’t about insurance reform – it is about government control.

          • So where is the GOP’s DETAILED plan??????? They have zero. Setting up fair and equitable health insure for all is more than 6 bullet points.

            ACA is working just fine in states where the governors have a brain and did a state exchange and expanded Medicaid.

        • Bull SHIT
          now we have a system we can NOT afford and as for denying coverage for per existing condition Just let your prospective carrier know you have a condition and see just how high your insurance goes. Premiums are now three time what they were 10 years ago. Because of obamanation care and the outright lies told by this worthless POS and his criminal administration we now have more uninsured Americans then there were 10 years ago and the people are now being forced to pay for insurance to cover Illegals and perverts. Yep that is the kind of system every third world FASCIST country needs. Only morons would think this farce is a good deal.

          • Wrong….. You need to talk to an actuary. We could not afford what we had and many Americans had zero. Insurance cost were huge and going up by double digits for 20 years prior to ACA. They have not gone up by double digits since 2010 (ACA eff date) in the past, prior to ACA Americans were canc, they were cut off in the middle of chemo treatments, not covered for routine delivery of babies because the mom was pregnant prior to the insure effective date or the ms diagnosis or diabetic diagnosis etc. I spoke to some of these terrified Americans trying to get them health coverage . You also should know the number one bankruptcy reason for Americans is MEDICAL BILLS, per the US Bankruotcy Court.

            ACA is a great start to help all Americans be able to see a dr. Just like democrates banded together with Repubs to fix bush’s Medicare D debacle back in 2006 (that’s still not paid for like the wars) repubs need to stop wasting our tax payer $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ trying to canc ACA but work on improving it because it’s not going away, thank God.

          • You are out of your mind !
            obamanation care-less is the beginning of the end of affordable health care in the U.S. It is nothing less than an outright attempt at fascism and the destruction of freedom by a would be dictator. As for the rest of you post it clearly shows that you have NONE of the facts or truth and many of the lies of the leftist morons. Even the government has now openly admitted that obamanation care-less can NOT work, as for it being a good place to start nothing could be further from the truth. Forcing a free people to pay for those who refuse to attempt to productively contribute to society is never a good place to start. History has proven repeatedly that the path OUR nation now walks ends in destruction and subjugation of the freedoms and rights of the people and the destruction of all advances we have made to this point. Please buy a history book you will see that I am correct in this, just as so many others have already done.

          • Sorry buddy, you are wrong. I gave you facts, you can only call folks names. ACA is doing fine and working. The repubs have proposed nothing in detail because they have nothing.

            I have helped sign up relatives and friends in different states that do not have coverage thru their employer or they turned 26 etc and they are doing just fine.

            You people seem a little nuts, but guess what!……. ACA has mental health ofc visits with no upfront deductiable if you live in a state where the governor had a brain and did a state exchange……

    • What has the GOP come up with to replace it, you ask?
      Well, you’ll just have to trust the GOP and pass their version to find out what it is!
      Isn’t that how Obamacare was passed?

    • Michael Dennewitz

      Stop snorting that shit, eh??

    • charles johnston

      Poor analogy, since both charge fees for use by the consumer. Obamacare was, and alwas has been, a sham to point toward “Single payer”. The only Americans thanking Obama are those getting a free ride off the taxpayers. Only the mentally defective don’t realize this is the largest redistribution of wealth and takeover of private industry America has ever seen. The system already in place could have been made to work easily, but that was not the liberal agenda. It was always about control, “Healthcare” was just a mask for takeover.

      • ACA allows Americans who did not have health insure coverage to see a dr, just like you and I can.

        • charles johnston

          That was the liberal dream and the propaganda. Truth is, many doctors and hospitals will not take the insurance, and if they do, many demand the deductable be paid up front. Noce try, but not true.

          • You are correct. In states governed by republicans they have done all they could to screw up Obamacare. They did not do an exchange so they only have 4 options to chose from… All with upfront high deductiables and limited hosp/Doctor participation. Most also did not expand Medicaid to cover the Americans who need the most medical help.

            Now go to a state that did a state exchange…… Those states have 10-20 health insure companies you can chose from. Some options on the exchange are local HMO’s that have NO upfront deductiables !!! Many doctors, many hospitals and many choices on benefits. You get to decide based on your benefit need and your budget.

            Those are the liberal FACTS. Try facts sometime.

          • charles johnston

            While you’re babbling on about facts, why don’t you provide some? Where are these states that provide 10-20 insurers? And I would prefer actual facts and not LIBERAL facts, as you so aptly called them. Here are some actual facts-
            There were only 17 state exchanges to start with, over half were in financial trouble after only two years and 6 state exchanges have already failed, dunping their folks into the federal exchanges; that would be Hawaii, Oregon, Nevada, Maryland, Massachusetts and Vermont. And the Obama administration just lost in court because the ACA was not legally able to pay those promised subsisies because of the legal language. Yeah,dh, you’re long on babble, short on actual facts, so list thos glorious states you are talking about with some ACTUAL facts.

          • New York and California both have 10-20 insures on their exchange and both expanded Medicaid. Kentucky also had many insurance companies on their exchange until the new republican governor !!!! The folks in Kentucky loved kentuckyconnect. Now hundreds in one of the poorest states will lose their ability to see a dr as the new repub governor is sadly canc the exchange. Folks are not happy in that state with their new ignorant governor. Mass has romneycare which is an ACA exchange as does Vermont. Both have just about 100% enrollment across their states.

            Several repub governed states have seen the error in their way as they are now expanding Medicaid.

          • charles johnston

            Still just blather, no facts with backup, and a NYT article I found doesn’t sound like Vermont is all that happy-
            “A number of state-based exchanges, after receiving a total of nearly $5 billion in federal establishment grants, are also encountering financial problems because they now must cover their own costs.

            But Vermont, with its initial view of the Affordable Care Act as a bridge to a single-payer system, is in a singularly unhappy position.

            “There’s a backlash against all things health care reform because Vermont Health Connect has been such a bad experience,” said Trinka Kerr, the chief health care advocate at Vermont Legal Aid, which gets several hundred calls a month from people who have encountered problems with the exchange, including billing errors and even delayed access to care. “Sometimes they’ll say, ‘I’ll just go without insurance,’ and we try to convince them that’s not a good plan. They don’t like the way this is working and want to go back to the old way.”
            Blather blather.

          • Your quotes are from 2011, I saw it. There were quotes like that all over in ACA’s initial year. It’s now 2016 and Vermont is doing just fine

            When bush passed Medicare d rx plan for seniors in 2006, without paying or budgeting for it like his lying wars, it was a disaster for more than a year. Guess what, the democrates worked with the repubs to help correct any issues and it’s working fine ( the cost though is part of our $19 trillion debt) plus the repub have spent billions and a gov’t shut down to screw ACA.

          • charles johnston

            Yeah, right.
            “Arguing with leftists is like playing chess with a pigeon. No matter how good you are at chess, the pigeon is going to knock over the pieces, crap on the board, and strut around like it is victorious.” – from RealScience
            There you go little pigeon.

    • Obama Hired Trump to open Obama care and told him to Pull a election Hoax in 2016 and to disquise himself as Hillary and Bernie Sanders so the Truth is Obama wants Trump to run against himself and to earn money Trump turned this into his Payed Job

      • Americans Wake Up

        What are you smoking? must be some good sh!t.

        • actually i am reading the bible in the Douay Rhimes version

          • Americans Wake Up

            Should read a version that is a translation from the original Greek. Latin Vulgate translation is a translation of a translation. Kind of like the King James is a translation of the Bishops Bible.
            New American is the closest translation to the original that can be found today.

    • Richard Trundle

      OK SMART A** I WORKED 47 YEARS FOR MINE. HOW HAVE YOU WORKED? IF YOU DON’T WORK YOU WILL NOT HAVE ANY. AND HAND-OUTS WILL STOP WHEN YOU REACH 65 OR WHAT EVER. KEEP ON LIVING IN YOUR DREAM LAND IT WILL END.

    • StupidConservativeValues

      The Republicant’s don’t offer anything but obstruction. they have no original thoughts.

    • However you choose to categorize Medicare and Social Security they are two more government programs that government has failed to manage appropriately, just as they have Obamacare. Actually, the VA system is closer to socialized medicine, much to the chagrin of most of the vets who are treated at those facilities. Given these examples, regardless of classification, why in the name of God would you want to give the government another huge program to screw up? Keep the few things that are good about Obamacare, write some protective laws for patients that we have complained about for years and give it back to the free market. Repeal, ABSOLUTELY. Replace with another government-run travesty, NEVER!

  4. soldier for liberty

    Communist!! Not liberals or progressives call the enemy by their real name it’s all by design !

    • Grow up and get a life. Right wing nuts and the GOP pushed this country over a cliff and Pres Obama saved your …….. And the rest of this country on 1/20/09. Sorry it’s taken so long to clean up the mess. The last depression took 20 years to get over.

        • FACTS:

          12/31/08 bush was losing 800,000 jobs a month, unemployment was 10%, bin laden was alive and the stock market was 6,000.

          12/31/15. Obama has had 70 months of positive job growth, unemployment is 5%, bin laden is dead and the stock market is 17,000 plus.

          • You ignant moron. How did Bush lose the jobs? HA HA HA The real estate bubble that crashed was because of the “Community Reinvestment Act”. I posted that before. Didn’t you look it up and see who was responsible for that debacle? Your “Facts” do not tell the cause, only the timing. Anyone who knows economics will know that it takes time for the laws to ruin an economy. Get some knowledge of how things really work before you expose your stupidity any more. Today there are more people on food stamps, out of work, lower incomes and poor. Workforce participation is lower than ~40 yrs. Those are the FACTS that tell the truth. Not the scrubbed propaganda Ovomit releases. Get an education, you IDIOT. Now GO AWAY before you look even mo ignant. ghetto trash

          • Facts have numbers and dates and FACTS. You can’t refruit facts with ugly words and nonsense sentences. The American people thanked Pres Obama for saving this country from the disaster of ANOTHER republican and bad GOP policies by RE-ELECTING him!

          • Ya, das how it hap’d blue gum. Facts have facts huh? Brilliant statement. How many people are losing arguments on here with? All of em. HA HA HA HA Read Dale Carnegie’s book you A$$wipe. You seem to be the outnumbered one here. Why do you come on sites like this and embarrass your uneducated ignorant racist self? It’s fun for us to see what a jerk you are. Take a course in LOGIC. Maybe it’ll help you understand common sense. But I doubt it. You FOOL.

  5. soldier for liberty

    Don’t tell me to grow up commie I own a successful business and am USMC veteran. I live to destroy you and your ilk!

    • Good for you, that means you have health insure!!! Thanks to Pres Obama and Obamacare 20 million Americans can do what you and I can do…….. See a doctor.

      ( so glad Obama kicked your ……. TWICE!!!)

  6. I have always said it was designed as a stepping stone to fail and have the government swoop in and save the day and complete the liberal goal! My question is where are all these Trump hating establishments plan to replace Obamacare? They have had all these years to develop and present the plan and NOTHING! If they were as serious as they say they would have one!!!! Tired of being played, TRUMP!

    • Trump has zero plans or proposals or anything, but I bet he has health insure!!!!

      • Now only the republicans have health insurance…. you are a lying moron. Most Democrats in the Government opted out of 0bamacare along with its namesake, 0bama.

        • you are the moron. Repubs continue to try and screw Americans out of health insure, while they made sure they did not lose their blue cross blue shield ID card!!
          ALL Federal government employees did not need Obamacare as their employer (federal govt) had over 30 health insure companies to chose from. It’s called FEP (federal employee plan) Every November, every federal employee can can chose any of the options they want. You don’t know what plan Pres Obama has under the FEP Plan. If you do you have broken the law. Just like I have no idea what insure plan you have as PHI rules apply.

          ACA is here to stay, thank God……..get lost.

          • BS, simply BS, both Democrats and Republicans in the Federal Government were given a get out of jail free card, when it came to 0bamacare…

            I do not appreciate being lied to. 0bama and the 100% Democrats in Congress lied to the American people about 0bamacare…

            The hypocrites exempted themselves from the Tax and that alone is Unconstitutional….

            All Taxes are supposed to be applied equally……

          • Federal employees have had health insure for over 40 years thru their employer, the federal government. They also have had a portion of their premium paid for over 40 years. Just like any other large employer like GE.

            No one was lied to, Americans got health insure and can see a dr, period.

          • Lies and more lies….

            The Federal employees are exempt from paying a tax that all others are forced to pay…

            The ONLY way 0bamacare could have been considered Constitutional was if it was a tax… The tax is not applied equally as federal employees are exempt…. That is a violation of the Constitution….

            Wish we were a nation of laws, but that went out the window with 0bama.

          • Facts stil alluding you I see.

          • You are the LIAR and your POS A$$WIPE LYING president.

          • Are you in 6th grade or 7th grade?

          • I got “Age promoted” cause I was 19 in eighth grade. Then I was pushd thru high school without learning nuthin. I got into college as a token racial admittant. I got free tuition cause i’m a minority. Didn’t learn nuthin. Den I gots inta med. schoo’ . Still kno nuttin. But I’s gots to wook in my cumoonitee on my owns peeps. Ain’t da happee. Boy, aint dis good ? An fare to? Amerka bes gud ta me. Now I gets ta cheet welfair fum da udder end. OOOOOOO I be soo lukee.

          • I didn’t think you could get more ignorant……. You have.

          • What’s wrong? Can’t handle the Bios. of your brothas and sistas takin Afro history and social justice majors? I went to college with fools like that. Where are they now? Teachin’ other incompetents like you crap that won’t help them in a competitive workplace. You are so f’n stupid it’s pitiful.

          • You F’ n IDIOT. It’s the slackers who are screwing working taxpayers out of their money so someone else has to pay for their ins.

          • Pres Reagan took care of that 30 years ago. You have been paying an indigent tax added to employer based health premium since Reagan signed the law allowing all to not be turned away at any ER in any state.

          • You posted it, the ER not ACA. You LIAR Go away cock roach

          • You have no idea what you are writing. And still can only call names. Are you 13 or 14 years old?

  7. Conservatives were crucified by the left for thinking that 0bamacare was designed to fail. The New York Times did their fair share of crucifying.

    The NY Times must be preparing its brainwashed for the inevitable conversion of 0bamacare to a single payer system.

    That liberal rag has as much blood on their hands as 0bama.

    • Thank God then 20 million Americans can see a doctor……….as can the Republican Party who has the blood on their hands trying to screw Americans out of seeing a dr.

      • How many of your 20 million are miscounted?
        How many actually had health care and lost it, and then settled for 0bamacare?
        EVERYBODY is paying more for their healthcare, except those subsidized by the Government, and the Government (You and Me) is paying more to subsidize those that cant pay….

        You spew facts that come from the very source that lied to us all. Only fools believe known liars…. Give me one good reason to think that anything you say is not a lie.

        It is compete and utter BS that people that needed to see a dr couldn’t see a dr in an emergency.

        • You do know we were paying “charges” in the ER for the folks who had zero health insure, right?!! Per the law signed by President Reagan in the 80’s no one could be turned away from any ER in the US. Reagan’s law stated charges those folks incurred were paid by a tax added to anyone who had health insure thru their employer….. That was you and I !!!! Health insur companies DO NOT pay “charges”. They pay negotiated discounted amounts. Now that many of the uninsured have ACA the rest of us are not paying that added tax. You need to talk to an actuary.

          • It was still better than 0bamacare…. The charges were fine, the Health Insurance was cheaper, and the services were better….

            The lefts incompetence and lies has broken a broken system. We are now paying a much greater tax in 0bamacare.

          • Wrong, but facts are hard for you folks.

            “Charges” are not fine. To walk into an ER is $1,000 “charges!!” ! An insure company would pay $200 to that same hosp as a discounted rate. To walk into a dr’s ofc earlier because you now have health insure in any illness for $75 is even cheaper.

          • You do not talk facts…. You talk lies.

          • You go pay a hospital bill without your health insure card. You will be billed “charges”. Use your health insure card and the bill to your insure company will be a discounted amount……….FACTS.

          • So my INSURANCE company gets the discounts….. They have two charge rates, one for the people and one for the insurance companies……

            No wonder they will not tell me how much a procedure is before they do it.

            Bend over, this wont hurt at all…………

          • “Charges” is the cost of a procedure /hospital stay/ER change if you have zero health insure. That will be the cost to you.

            “Discount” is the contractual rate your health insure company will will pay the hosp/dr if you have health insure.

            Americans without health insure prior to ACA have been bent over paying charges or not seeing a dr at all.

          • Tough $hit !!! Then pay for it like the rest of WORKING TAXPAYERS you F’n LEACH.

          • Well thank God they now have insurance and they all pay !!!! Some pay less premium than others but EVERYONE on ACA pays.

          • LIAR. Look at the truth you jerk. Stop with the lies. The liar in chief said there were 40 million without ins. 20 million got it. That means 20 million still without. You F’n LIAR. Go away.LIAR

          • Thanks to repub governors who are not expanding Medicaid or doing a state exchange.

          • Maybe that’s why thousands of people are moving to those states, leaving blue states in droves.Blue states are bankrupting themselves paying for free crap you parasites demand in exchange for votes. Red states are responsible. Look it up DIMWIT.

          • Do you know the difference between OK and a fine? Thought not…

            Words seem hard for you folks to understand… So I shall reword my sentence so even your SIMPLE mind can comprehend.

            The charges were OK,

          • Charges are not ok.

      • Americans Wake Up

        last numbers release were 7-8 million on Obamacare and about 6 million on Medicaid.

  8. Planned my ass, it was a failure from the beginning, a socialists mess that fascist scumbag Obama pushed down our throats. Glad it failed, it should be removed along with that fascist liar Obama.

  9. So, why not a healthcare system like many counries have in Europé…………whereby every body gets FREE Healthcare, medication and dental care………..and it is free when one gets the service………..of coursesomeone has to pay, so it is financed thru the taxes that are paid……….did someone say that taxes are very very high in Europé…….so if there are any Americans who know how much taxes people pay on the incomes, in for example……Sweden, then please comment

  10. Richard Trundle

    YEP A FEDERAL JUDGE HAS ALREADY RULED IT WAS FUNDED ILLEGAL….

  11. Americans Wake Up

    You know what I love about all the government programs? Nothing! When you use them you lose everything. Your pride, self esteem, assets. Anything you worked all you life for the government takes when you need to rely on Medicaid/Medicare. You are allowed to have $1500 in assets -period! If you need nursing or nursing home care you lose your home, your savings, your SSI, and any other money you have coming in. You work hard all your life and the effin’ government gets everything in the end.

  12. In spite of the Supreme Court’s creative ruling, there is nothing in the US Constitution authorizing the Federal Government to establish health care.
    Regardless of whether you are for obozocare or sane, the Supreme Court does not have the authority to create law. Their sole duty is to determine if the written law complies with the Constitution. And any JUDGE who uses his/her opinion to create law should be impeached and never be allowed to serve as a judge in any court.

    • StupidConservativeValues

      I agree: “And any JUDGE who uses his/her opinion to create law should be impeached and never be allowed to serve as a judge in any court.”

      The left has had enough of activist conservative judges! Looking down on you in hell Scalia!

      You don’t posses the ability to apply reason do you? The constitution does not have to authorize the authority to create legislation.

      • charles johnston

        And the SCOUS does not have the Constitutional authority to create law, but has become a political toy of the left.

        • “my room mate Mary Is getting paid on the internet 98$/hr”…..!jk475etwo days ago grey MacLaren P1 I bought after earning 18,512 Dollars..it was my previous month’s payout..just a little over.17k Dollars Last month..3-5 hours job a day…with weekly payouts..it’s realy the simplest. job I have ever Do.. I Joined This 7 months. ago. and now making over. hourly 87 Dollars…Learn. More right Here !jk475e:➽:➽:➽➽➽➽ http://GlobalSuperJobsReportsEmploymentsEarthGetPay-Hour$98…. .✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸::::::!jk475e….,……

        • Just because you did not win….. Too bad.

        • You are correct about that but they have been packing and playing loose with the courts at all levels. American voters really need to understand that and get deeply involved with every election when it comes to the courts. Liberals have been using the courts to change and rewrite legislation since the 1960’s.

          • charles johnston

            And if the law doesn’t suit them, they make it up.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Just like activist conservative justice pissing on American laws.

          • charles johnston

            The only place you find pissing on American laws is the SCOUS.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            And tea baggers in Congress “bagging” each other wherever they can.

          • Who would want to bag Killary, Pizzlozi, Fitzstein or Reid??

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Tea Baggers don’t care, just as long as they can get their balls inside one another’s mouths.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            You would after scrubbing your scrotum.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Its: SCOTUS you scrotum.

          • charles johnston

            Word police now? You got the meaning, dipwad.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            I actually you thought someone was going to appointed to your SCROTUM. Do you have any, or do your lips get in the way? Well, either way, someone has to keep the rubes in line. When they use facts incorrectly, (as is their wont), well golly gosh, it’s a liberal’s patriotic duty to keep the uneducated properly informed.

          • charles johnston

            Stupid as always, but that is your name. You couldn’t keep a crippled poodle in line.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            “You couldn’t keep a crippled poodle in line.” ? You’re an odd one.

        • StupidConservativeValues

          Regarding the first part of your statement, that is correct; however, relative to the second part; you’re bat shit crazy.

          • charles johnston

            Oh yeah, says the idiot with stupid as part of his name.. Keep on proving it

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Calling yourself an idiot doesn’t help your cause of recruiting developmentally delayed pinheads. But, I suppose you just want to keep on proving you are an abortion that lived.

          • charles johnston

            That’s all you got? Guess anything more than calling names and making an arrogant a$$ of yourself is WAY above a room temp IQ like yours. Keep it up. We’re all laughing. Intelligent humor you’re not. . . more like the three stooges.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            “more like the three stooges:” Trump, Ryan and McConnell.

        • StupidConservativeValues

          The Republican’t Senate is toying with the: U.S. Constitution and the; American people by not holding SCOUS hearing as DEMANDED by the US Constitution. Also, you may want to research your local area for classes on critical thinking…it may relieve the embarrassment factor when you write your gibberish.

          • charles johnston

            Turnabout is fair play. Obama has been toying with it for 8 years.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Then why for God’s sake didn’t the House impeach Obama if he is so bad. Oh right…Denny Hastert is in prison dropping the soap and Gingrich is to busy givingTrump rimjobs to try and be picked for vice-president.

          • charles johnston

            Just like you. Got nothing, so you make it up. Typical liberam numbnuts. Keep it up. Ever thought of a career in deep fiction? Oh, never mind. You don’t have that many functioning brain cells. Pot kills a lot of them.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Okay, I’ll keep it up. No Viagra needed.

          • charles johnston

            Yeah. Stupid quips is all you got. Put down that joint and get out of your mother’s basement.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Yea? After I get out, do I go to one of your American Nazi rallies?

          • charles johnston

            Don’t belong. You can just go to your gay pride parade.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            What’s a gay pride parade?

          • Perfect again!!!!!!

          • Do you have health insurance?…… Thought so.

          • charles johnston

            And you, asking and answering your own questions now. Ever though of professional help?

          • Have to help you all.

          • charles johnston

            I don’t need help. You do.

          • Do you have health insurance?

          • charles johnston

            Of course and it goes up every year thanks to the socialist/Marxist puppet in the WH. How ’bout you? You gettin’ them jucy subsidies?

          • You must live in a red state….. Too bad.

          • charles johnston

            Joke’s on you. You pay them all, just like you pay all of social security premium. And yes, I live in a red state and proud of it. We have a dearth of liberal idiots like you.

          • And your state is broke. The blue states keep you going.

            No I do not pay all my premium just like congress. The government pays 70% of their health premium and the federal employees pay 30%. My employer pays 80% I pay 20%. We all pay into ss and when you turn 65 you get it back. If you take a&b of Medicare, part a is free if you worked enough quarters. If you take part b you pay for it and that premium comes out of your ss check.

            Do you need any other help understanding your benefits? SS, health insur etc is not a joke as some Americans are dying and starving. Dems will save all of us again from the disaster called GOP policies.

          • charles johnston

            I thought you were a liberal idiot. You just proved it. You pay all your insurance, whatever, because it’s a cost of employing you, no matter what you call it. Stupid.

          • He had facts, you had name calling.

          • charles johnston

            Stupid with facts?? You’re as funny as he is.

          • Facts are what count. Your/his name calling and jibberish means nothing. Thank God there aren’t enough of you folks to screw this country again.

          • charles johnston

            What facts exactly are you blathering about? Stupid never has any. He’s a troll. dh keeps presenting opinion as fact. Show me some fact.

          • See above FACTS I gave kmiller.

          • charles johnston

            Where?

          • Look at the facts about the economy, food stamps, poverty, 62% workforce participation. illegals and embedded terrorists crossing our borders. Get your ugly head out your fat a$$ and grasp reality you F’n LEACH

          • Facts are bush was losing 800,000 jobs a month on 12/31/08
            Facts are unemployment was 10% on 12/31/08
            Facts are 10,000 plus Americans had been killed/maimed in cheney’s lying war by 12/31/08
            Facts are the auto industry was going bankrupt 12/31/08
            Facts are the stock market was was 6,000 on 12/31/08

            AFTER PRESIDENT OBAMA

            Facts are the clean up for the above disaster cost billions and it’s still on going as that hole was pretty deep. (And Clinton had left bush with a surplus!!)

            Facts are 72 straight months of job growth as of 12/31/15
            Facts are unemployment is 5% as of 12/31/15
            Facts are 10,000 soliders are nit dying in Iraq as of 12/31/15
            Facts are the auto industry had their best year ever as of 12/31/15
            Facts are the stock market was 17,000 on 12/31/15

            I don’t need to swear or call names with FACTS.

          • 1. The most brilliant economists conclude that the “Community Reinvestment Act”, pushed thru entirely by Dumba$$oc RATS, was responsible for the 08 meltdown. Look it up. 2. Today the workforce participation rate is ~ 62%. If you account for you slugs feigning disability, unemployment is around 21% today. Remember they don’t count you if you’ve been out of work for a few months. Look it up. 3. Do you know how many Dumba$$oc RATS , House and Senate, voted for that war with the same intelligence the rest of the world had? Look it up. 4. Union dumba$$oc RATS artificially inflated their salaries to price themselves out of the market to sell cars competitively, by constant strikes demanding more benefits. Look it up. 5The stock market dropped with the real estate bubble (caused by Dumba$$oc RATS ) burst. Look it up. 6. There are fewer people, %, working now than in decades. & the LYING fraud president pulled out of Iraq and created a vacuum which was filled when ISIS was created and filled that void. Now the idiot in the white house is sending more US military back after he screwed things up so terribly. Look it up. 7. Car companies are relocating in Mexico China etc. Look it up. 8. I’m lovin’ the stock market. However it’s the poor and middle class who’ve seen their wages drop or stagnate, more people on food stamps than ever before.and more people in poverty. Look it up. THOSE are true facts, not spin. Get an education in something other than cultural history and you may cultivate the dead brain in your rotting skull. Do not answer this until you’ve looked up the FACTS I’ve listed. You only confirm your ignorance and stupidity to all the others on here that you’ve been arguing with. You are a pathetic loser.

          • As I told your ignorant buddy above, see you in November when your racist dangerous bigot gives his concession speech. I gave you facts you gave me b s, as usual.

          • I disproved the Dumba$$oc RAT talking points you mentioned with facts and logic. Apparently you don’t have the education to understand common sense. Blue state inner city public education. So sad. You are a waste of oxygen.

          • Everyone on here is watching you display your blatant racism and stupidity. Keep it up. You’re giving people reasons to disregard and disrespect your peeps.

          • charles johnston

            Losing jobs thanks to Clinton and Glass-Stegal repeal
            Unemployment 1.8 million under Obama’s first 4 months- that’s why they changed the reporting nomenclature- you’re wrong
            72% of casualties in Afganistan and Iraq occurred under Obama, not Cheney or Bush
            Auto companies DID go bankrupt- wrong again- they still owe the government 56 million
            Adjusted for inflation, stock market has recovered very little.
            Your facts are liberal/ democrat talking points. Very transparent and always wishful thinking.

          • You both are too ignorant to have a discussion with. See you in November when the racist bigot has to give his concession speech. You lost and will continue to lose cause facts beat b s.

          • charles johnston

            Lost what? You’re the one running away. And don’t count your chickens before November, gal. Gop raw popular vote is over 4 million ahead of the dems. In Kentucky Tuesday, out of 1.7 registered dems, only 423,000 bothered to vote. Not very excited about the chooices, huh? The Hildabeast will be lucky to stay out of prison and she’ll never be president. Her negatives are worse than Trumps’s and he just went ahead of her in a national poll. Folks don’t like Trump a lot, but they like Killery less.

          • Perfect!!!!!!

          • EASY,

            All are RINO/democrat establishment people who his Royal Exalted Bomma (Berry Heil! Berry Heil! Berry Heil!!!) has in his pocket.

            Time for a complete House Cleaning,,,and the Senate too.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            After cleaning house, the Republicans can give each other enemas to clean out their shit.

        • Not even close. The judges of our Supreme Court are without exception highly learned in the law, and the Constitution in particular. They also have access to heaps of worthy advice. They have to justify their decisions to the legal profession. Of course, as decent human beings, they have personal feelings about the fairness of legislation, but they dare not let that interfere with a strict interpretation of the law.

          So they might know a bit more about this issue than we do.

          It is only when you disagree with SCOTUS outcomes that you start believing in naive conspiracy theories about the corruption of judges.
          Read the reasons for their decision if you want to understand why they disagree with you.

          Over to you now for the usual ad hominem rant…….

      • Troll. Don’t feed ’em.

      • It should be term limits on them. What if one gets dementia???

    • Well said. The entire law was sold by a group of someones with less scruples than used car salesmen and if the law was a car, they would all be put in jail as scam artists. Including the Judges that turned their back on their duties.

      When Injustice becomes law, Resistance becomes duty.

        • yes, don’t you?????????

          • Excellent…… hundred upvotes for you.

          • And you are another fool.

          • Hell no. Americans are to crazy to be allowed to own guns.

          • When the UN “Dicktators” and “O” want to rule our country, you will wish you had a gun. I guess you will give up because you think it is OK to live under a “Dicktator” or you are not an American because if you are, you included yourself as crazy. Take a class, get trained and own a gun.

          • Oh please we know you are a racist bigot with your code words. Real Americans don’t need guns.

          • I have black friends, my daughter-in law babysit black children when my grandchildren were young.

            You wouldn’t know a code word if you saw one. When we have a financial meltdown and rioting in the streets, coming to your house to steal what little food you have left for your children, you will wish you had a gun.

            So, please bigot, racist DemoRat un- American Diane take your Azz somewhere else.

          • Guns are for cowards with other short comings.

          • You are an uneducated, low information person, just some of your short comings.

          • You wish I was so I could not call you out on your b s.

          • You are the one with the name calling on everyone you do not know and assuming they are racist & bigots=low information and uneducated. You are the one spouting BS.

            You need to read the UN agenda for 2030 and find out what the ones in power right now are working towards. Good Bye!

          • Tell that to yo black bruthers, da gangbangers, in every major city. The same scum collecting welfare.

          • That would be the poor white folks up in them ther hills!!! And in rural red states. More welfare and food stamps in Texas, Alabama, Mississippi, fla etc then any inner city. Oh and don’t forget the welfare corporate farms collecting welfare subsidies.

            You have no clue, but no problem the democrates will save the day like they always have.

          • You just proved your ignorance again. What’s a “Democrate” Some group of parasites that “Crates ” working taxpayers money off in order to pay lazy leaches to vote for em? There are ~ 6X more caucasians than negroes in the US. Naturally, there’d be more total in number drawing aid. Why don’t you look at the % of the populations (minorities) that are irresponsibly living off other’s taxes. Too difficult for a ignoramus like you? You a$$wipes on the left skew facts to fit your agenda. Too bad you’re not bright enough to understand how to correctly analyze the stats to come up with the truth. Why don’t you call someone names, then call them a name caller, again, you stupid hypocrite.

          • You are just ignorant. . Thank God they aren’t enough of you poor white trash to screw this country again. Can’t wait to hear the racist bigot give his concession speech. Hahaha.

          • Figured it wouldn’t take too long for you to show your racism. You, dh and stup. cons. values are nothing but ignant (Sharpton) racist scum bag parasitic leaches, who can’t make it on your own intelligence and hard work. Keep demanding the free stuff you blood sucking cockroach.

          • Come to my place if you need food so badly.
            I don’t want to shoot my starving neighbours.

          • charles johnston

            That all you got? Perpetual victim mentality. Sad.

          • She is right. Brave people are not so paranoid that they feel the need for a gun.
            Victim mentality is a paranoid psychosis

          • charles johnston

            More propaganda from the looney left? No paranois, psycosis nor bravery involved and you know it.

          • No I don’t know it. Paranoia is the only possible explanation for so many Americans wanting guns.

          • charles johnston

            First you should learn the definition of paranoia and use it correctly. It was not suspicion that the British wanted to disarm the colonists- that was the first battle of the revolution- they made it plan that an unarmed population was their desire. Our founders made it plain too that armed men and women are citizens, those unarmed are slaves, and went to the trouble of writing that into the Constitution. Disarming citizens prior to enslavement is practiced all over the world- not paying attention? Then you have the Hildabeast, talking openly about disarming Americans, then Bernie chiming in too, same rhetoric to stay way left for the likes of you. There are millions of guns today that will harm nobody, just as there are untold thousands of firearms that will prevent, contain or stop an attack on the person carrying the weapon. You won’t hear of those except possibly local news because MSM caters to those of your ilk. No, there are many explanations, personal and wider, for gun ownership that the looney left is too lazy or stupid to understand. You’re just propagandizing again. Won’t fly here.

          • All you have to do is read UN Agenda 2030 and see what is planned for our country and if you want to live under “Dicktators” go to another country. No one is paranoid, just realistic and facing the facts. Uneducated are people that don’t investigate everything that the government does and that looks like you and Diane.

          • I read 2030, and I liked it very much.
            Particularly:”They seek to realize the human rights of all and to achieve gender equality and the empowerment of all women and girls. They are integrated and indivisible and balance the three dimensions of sustainable development: the economic, social and environmental.”
            What’s not to like about that.
            Thanks. Good old UN

          • Do you really think that mixing all the races, etc. is going to work? There are different cultures and some are still barbaric and also in the way they treat women and girls, FGM, etc. They can do all of this in each country not getting rid of borders. The indoctrination of the school children, no morality or right and wrong. You need to look at the darker side of the UN.

            There is a lot that can be done in each country without having the rich and powerful take over (“Dicktators”), most of them are corrupt and involved in sex with children.

          • Says it all really. We Americans need guns because we are shit scared of just about everything, especially each other. It is a national psychosis, and who wants to live in a country full of armed psychotics.

          • charles johnston

            Off your meds again?

        • StupidConservativeValues

          Happiness is a warm Gun…bang bang shoot shoot! When I hold it my arms and I feel my fingers on the trigger, I know, nobody can do me no harm…except Mark David Chapman.

      • The prime prevaricator was Jonathon Gruber and he even voluntarily admitted it, he was so proud.

      • I fought every chance I had but I have 2 DemoRat Senators and I know for sure that one did not read it.

        • Not reading Bills is normal practice. Understanding legislation is very difficult and requires expertise that most senators don’t have. They don’t need to read it because they are told how to vote by their party. If they really want to understand they will read the explanatory memorandum that accompanies the Draft Bill, or they will discuss it in the party room.

          It is no different on the other side.

          • Maybe they should pass small bills that are written in English instead of the very strange legal-ease in this bill. I work in a law firm and no one here writes like that.

          • Legislative drafting is a legal specialty because it uses many conventions so that laws may not be misinterpreted or challenged in court. So there is good reason reason for them to be the way they are. It is just naive to say that some senators did not even bother to read the Obamacare bill. When the vote comes up in the house, they must do what they are told by to do their party.

          • That bill had flaws. Then he changed it ILLEGALLY, after it was signed into law. REMEMBER? Look it up.

      • The entire law allows Americans to be able to see a dr. No more no less. I am sure you have health insurance.

        • But, you can not keep your Dr. , PERIOD
          But you can not keep your Health Insurance, PERIOD

          You will not save $2,500/year, PERIOD.

          All lies, all told by a liar whom we should impeach for those lies.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Seems you’re having issues with your PERIOD.

          • Gee, I kept my plan and my dr. My employer did not canc our company insurance. You know who else kept their paid for state government plan and dr?!!……. Every single red state governor, but they screwed you and everyone else in your state by not doing a state exchange or expand Medicare.

            The police and fireman in your city did not lose their coverage, the catholic priest in your town did not lose their health plan, neither did the teachers or the Koch employees or the fox tv employees or the heritage foundation employees or Bain Capitol employees or GE employees or congress or any other federal state or city employee across this country.

            Lying Cheney should have been impeached or thrown under the jail for lying this country into a war not paid for that killed and maimed more than 10,000 American soliders and caused the mess we are dealing with in the Middle East. Americans watched who screwed us. Americans awarded the person who saved this country from another depression and rotten GOP policies by voting him in a second term!!!!!! Hillary will continue the clean up that barrack started.

          • But, then again, you are a liar, and can not prove anything you say…. So I doubt seriously you kept your plan and your dr…. You are a snake oil 0bamacare insurance salesman, that prays on peoples life savings…

            You are just a typical liberal.

          • “Liberal’ in an honorable title in the real world. Much better than “Conservative”.

          • Liberal has been turned into hypocrite and liar by the leaders the liberals have chosen to lead them….

            I am afraid history is repeating itself and Liberals are being used as useful idiots.. Liberals are ideologically demoralized and incapable of recognizing just how enslaved they are.

            https://youtu.be/mqSV72VNnV0

          • And liberals will kick your ……. Once again in November!!!

          • The Liberals are not fighting a fair fight…. They are fixing the votes… We are all being disenfranchised, and none of the American Peoples votes are being counted…

            Bernie is CRUSHING Hillary everywhere he goes, yet Hillary’s machine is counting the votes… And guess what? Hillary wins by 52% to 48%…

            “It is enough that the people know there was an election. The people who cast the votes
            decide nothing. The people who count the votes decide everything.”
            —-Joseph Stalin

            Liberals do not kick anybodies ass… they lie and cheat…

          • We kicked yours TWICE. Hahahaha

          • Good honest people are hurt and damaged and you do a happy dance……

            You are the devil.

          • Yes, repubs and trump are hurting, cheating, lying and are racists and bigots hurting good honest people.

          • Everybody else is a racist and you’re calling others “White trash” Aunt Jemima, that’s rich.

          • You know this is just spam.

          • Since a liberal saved your ….and the rest of our country From the disaster he was handed by bush and lying Cheney on 1/20/09 you should be more grateful. The rest of America was as they re-elected that wonderful liberal TWICE!!!!!!!

          • A liberal has cost more lives than he saved, he takes credit for killing 0sama bin lauden but delivered 25+ of the very seal team six members to Islamic terrorist in trade….

            I doubt seriously that 0bama won either of his elections without fixing the election…. And you claim that a cheat and liar won,,,, 0bama couldn’t win an honest election….. PERIOD….

          • Zero voter fraud, but you a holes can’t stand the fact that brilliant black man kicked your …. TWICE!!! And he could kick it again!!! Hahahahahahahahahaha. Obama put together the plan to get bin laden, he then gave the “go a head” and seal team six carried out Pres Obama’s plan. The American people (with brains) watched what happened and rewarded the president with 4 MORE YEARS.

            You lost fair and square, get over it.

          • If he’s so brilliant, why is he hiding his college transcripts? Every other “White” president showed theirs. What’s “Step and fetch it” hiding? The unqualified bonehead can’t even give a speech without a telepromptor. You ever see it? HA HA HA He be a Fool.

          • It is a party rule that politicians should use teleprompters in order to stay on the party line.. Most of them are very grateful for that, because they cannot think and stand upright at the same time. My observation is that President obama is a highly intelligent and articulate man who can compose an excellent speech as he goes along: if he has to. Nevertheless, he is still smart enough to use a teleprompter to make sure he does not omit anything important or get side-tracked by silly questions.

            His college transcripts are his private business, and nothing to do with you. I wish mine were as good. Can youi imagine what W’s were likie?

          • I don’t think you got past 4th grade spelling. “what W’s were ‘likie'” If they’re not important , then why does Dumba$$oc RAT party demand opposition candidates records? When W released his after demands to compare them with Gore’s in 2000 election, they were better than both Gore’s and Kerry’s in 2004. HA HA HA HA If you saw any video of Oblablabla trying to answer questions with a script you’d be embarrassed. I’m happy his and your ignorance was exposed, If you think he’s so smart,why doesn’t he listen to his military advisors? Panetta,Gates and many other top military men with years of service experience are now saying that he’s a bumbling idiot. Look it up, you lying bumbling idiot. Go have your seance with idiots dh and Diane. 99% of commenters on here disagree with you FOOLS. Go away.

          • What a charming fellow you are Mr Miller. Are all conservatives as well-mannered and couth as you are?

            So I type fast, and sometimes hit two keys without noticing? Big deal! get over it. If you weren’t so proud of your thumb typing and 4th grade spelling you would not notice it.

            I admire our president for listening very well to his military advisers, but not always doing what they want. He is their boss, and he has a lot more to take into account than they do.
            Our the best generals would never slander their Commander in
            Chief. If they are doing that, then they are probably incompetent assholes who should
            be ignored.

            99% of statistics are made up to bolster bad arguments. Yes I think the Democrats are wrong if they are demanding academic records. W’s parents made big donations to Harvard.

            Dianne and dh are clearly smarter than you, and they have much better manners.

            You really don’t need to be a nuckle dragging Conservative. Why not ask your Mommy if she can teach you some social graces.

          • And a charmer you are. Calling career service, high ranking military lifers cowardly incompetent a$$holes. That defines you as a hypocrite, not a charmer. Dumba$$. Did you ever hear of rereading what you post in order to correct mistakes, or is that your new ebonics? Do you admire the moron in the white house for all the lies he tells, also? Gates (Sec. Defense) and Panetta also, have come out publicly and made those claims. Look it up before you make yourself look even more ignant (Sharpton). What barn did you 3 get your education? My doctorate is from a well known LARGE University. Ironic how the 3 of you use my caricatures of you, later in posts. That shows your own lack of intelligence, or literacy, doesn’t it? Although I enjoy pointing out the ignorance, lack of common sense, inferior upbringing and inability to understand the truth(only what Dumba$$oc RATS have pounded into your coconut skulls full of mush for brains) I’ve got better things to do than give all your opponents on here more to chuckle at. Get your high school or 8th grade equivalency and get off conservative sites. These are for more intelligent people. Now go away.You F’n DUNCE.

          • My degree? USNA That’s where I learned about loyalty to the Chief. That is why I call career service officers who undermine their commander cowardly rats who should resign or be fired.
            Even conservative websites should show some common sense and decency.
            You make all conservatives look like idiots.

          • Marcus Owens Univ. of Iowa.Look it up. SUNY Albany, look it up. I doubt you learned anything there, other than quotas and social justice, as you come off as judge and jury to all conservatives. It was a couple weeks ago when several high military officials said they would disobey orders if they thought it was against the law. You forget that? The unqualified, lying, monkey impersonator in the white house has broken numerous laws, but his minority status, is used as an excuse to ” Let it go this time, we’ll be called racists if we go against it”. Did you learn personal responsibility, ethics, and character. How about spreading THAT to the other leach loving parasites you associate with, instead of lying and complaining , while demanding MO’ free stuff.

          • OK, I will explain it for you and I will try not to use big words.

            When a soldier accepts a promotion to General rank he or she becomes a member of the Administration. If in the future they cannot support the elected Administration then they must resign, and they can be as public as they want to about that including in their criticism of their Commander in Chief. What they cannot do is retain their rank and appointment in the military. I was only a Navy officer, but that obligation was quite clear to me and to all my colleagues. It is exactly the same for any other senior appointment to the current Administration.
            Now to your hyperbole:
            We currently have the best qualified President we have ever had in a renowned Harvard Law Constitutional expert. I also think he is honest, suave, a class act, and a great credit to the USA in every way. His race is irrelevant except to people like you.

            When you use gross exaggerations as you did then, you de-value everything else you say. That is why you seldom see sensible people doing and only shock jocks in the media.

            I don’t take any free stuff or associate with parasites, that must be your other friends.

          • You admitted your mistake. That’s a 1st step. The 3 I mentioned are ex administration, military men. Look it up. Do you believe lying over and over again is considered “Bad” ethics? If so, then this unqualified pres. lacks ethics. A qualified person would be proud of their qualifications. Do you agree? I have my diplomas, degrees including the one that states, “Graduated with Honors” on my Doctorate. Other Lawyers, physicians and dentists all are proud of their records and post them in their offices. Why is this guy hiding his records? Have you ever REALLY, stopped to think about that, as an “Ethical” person? Most, if not all, as I remember released their college transcripts. Not this LIAR. The most “Transparent administration in history”, MY A$$. Try googling Obama United Church of Christ , homosexual relations/murder. See what you find. This is not “Ethical” behavior. Then google Larry Sinclair, you’ll see part of what’s being hidden. Any person running for President of the US has responsibility to all citizens to release records, even personal stuff, as that can show “Character” which is a trait this moron lacks. I don’t know how many times I’ve heard, “But they all lie”. As a Naval officer, would you appreciate serving directly under a LIAR? I understand that certain high level security info has to be kept secret, but this mope has lied about Everything from the healthcare bill to Iran deal and Benghazi. Doesn’t that bother ,even you?

          • I presume he was sending a message to those demanding his academic

            records. I would give them the finger too.
            Whe you google for evidence you should try to avoid conservative web sites or news media. You won’t find anything reliable there.

            That is exactly what happened when I took your advice to Google “Larry Sinclair”. Why do you believe such rubbish? Because you want it to be true.

            The truth was there if you had really looked for it.
            http://www.politico.com/story/2008/06/obama-accuser-has-long-rap-sheet-011164

            I served under a few liars in my time. Thatr is inevitable and you learn to deal with it. The Army is much worse. Did you ever read about General Douglas MacArthur in Australia during WWII? Or read “About Face” by Colonel David Hackworth.

          • You gloss over again. Did you look up Unity Church of Christ murders/ Obama? You didn’t mention that. When it went down, I talked with a detective Chi. PD. He saw the paperwork. Apparently you agree with ; “The ends justify the means” even if it’s unlawful. Life or death situations OK, but to ramrod a leftist/socialist political agenda by lying and ,basically, stealing by redistribution, is not the country our founders envisioned.

          • Yes, I looked them up on:https://fellowshipoftheminds.com/2010/07/25/mom-of-murdered-obama-gay-lover-speaks-up/
            which is a crank religious cult website.

            I am inclined to accept the Wikipedia explanation.
            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trinity_United_Church_of_Christ
            This story emanated from a very strange black Christian/Muslim movement that has absolutely no credibility at all.
            nb:
            ———————-
            “In the early 1930s, Nation of Islam leader Elijah Muhammad moved his embroiled religion’s headquarters from Detroitto Chicago. Mixing elements of the Bible and the Qur’an, Elijah Muhammad taught that Africans were the Earth’s first and most important people. He prophesied that a time was coming when African Americans would be fully vindicated, released from their various oppressions, and brought into full freedom within their own geographical state. For this to actualize, however, Elijah Muhammad taught that blacks had to radically separate from all whites. In addition, he proclaimed that blacks needed to live a moral life.”
            ——————————
            You constasntly accuse me of not researching your fantasy stories well enough. Why don’t you research them properly yourself before reporting them to the rest of us?

            Here is a hint how to do it. After you Google, reject the first 10 hits because they will usually have been promoted to the top of the search results by many other patriotic conservative bloggers feverishly trying to find the dirtiest mud to throw at their Commander in Chief.
            I find the Wikipedia hits most reliable. You still have to exercise your critical thinking powers with Wiki, but usually the most rabid spin stories will have been rejected, and you will find a believable explanation. It still might not be the truth, but then I am Occams.

          • Do you think that a competent Constitutional expert should know the process of an idea becoming a law? Isn’t a bill written in Congress , then passed by both houses before it gets to the presidents desk for him to sign it into law or veto it? If the president doesn’t like certain provisions in the bill, he (she) can then send it back to congress where it may be altered, and both houses have to again, vote on it before it goes back to the president, correct?How, then, does this idiot think he has the authority to change existing laws, just by writing them onto the bill, without sending it back to Congress? Did you ever think about that? If you think this moron is a true patriot, google Philip Haney, then get back to me and answer these I’ve put to you. if you were really a USN officer with ethics and character, I believe this conduct is appalling to you and you will look up the stuff I posted to you. Diane dh and S. Con. blablabla never did answer the questions I had, only resorted to personal attacks and Dumba$$oc RAT talking points. I don’t want any more of that crap. You seem intelligent and responsible, and I hope you’ll answer these questions in a civil manner.

          • I agree with your cut an paste about the president’s powers to make legislation. I also understand his power to make regulations under legislation. Do you? Most of the laws we must obey are regulations made under an enactment, that are drafted and enforced by the Administration through Departments and industry regulators. So I assume that the President’s annotations were about how the draft bill would be regulated.
            That could well be something that Congress needs to know and they may choose to cover it in the Act rather than the Regs. So it would be entirely appropriate for the President to write on a bill like that. He usually does not need Congress to approve regulations, and they can be made long after the Bill has passed.

          • What I was referring to, were not regulations. Why do you not look any of this up and only add your assumptions in order to defend this crap? I’ve seen judges and Congresspeople make those claims. Your argument has no basis in fact.

          • Because I have a life that keeps me very busy. The world of conservative spin merchants is so full of links to sopin web sites that If I go in there I will do a lot of work that no one will pay me for and in the end it will prove to have been a wild goose chase. It is either all made up, or based on a thin grain to truth that is grossly distorted.

            I know how executive power works because I have seen it up close. I believe that we now have a President who knows the law governing his position so well that he is confident exercising powers that other Presidents may have assumed that they don’t have.
            Any claims that judges and congress people may have made need to be examined carefully. I do not have the time or inclination to do that because I think you would find that they are based on a misinterpretation of “ultra vires”. If any of his highly significant executive decisions really were beyond his power they would be challenged in court and rejected. That is not happening, and that satisfies me.

          • A likely response from the sheeple. My sympathy.Too bad !!!

          • Mr Miller, Sir, that is an unworthy response at my fair attempt to address questions that you asked me.

            I assume your “sheeple” is an attempt to characterise certain people as ignorant sheep who unquestioningly follow their leader: much a Jesus did to the early Christians.
            By suggesting that you should exercise some critical judgement in relation to conservative spin websites I was acting most unlike a sheep, and suggesting that you do the same.
            Or, was it merely an indication that you have run out of puff and are falling back on the staple diet of the inhabitante here: personal abuse.

            D- re-submit

          • Not true. You make weak attempts to avoid the questions using generalities. You are beyond belief. Too far up the Leftists arces. You need help. The greatest country ever formed on this earth is being destroyed by socialists and communists working together. It’s people like you who help them along. Go away.

          • I give you much more considered and informed answers than you give me. All I get from you is repetitive demands that I should react to some insane beat-up in the conservative media. I have no respect whatsoever for your sources.

            There are probably no real socialists or communists left in the USA, aside from a few sad academic or political relics like Bernie Sanders. They are totally harmless. It is much the same in the rest of the world, although socialist welfare policies are better-managed and respected in many other places than they are here.

            “Red under the beds” has been a scare tactic of conservative political parties since the Cold War era. It worked well to get them re-elected a few times because Americans love to be afraid. Many fine young Americans died horribly or suffered terrible injuries because such scare tactics sent us into the Vietnam War. The USA was never the slightest bit threatened by North Vietnam. It beat us and now we are friends again.
            I think that it is quite pathetic to bring out that sad strategy again at this time in our history. We should have grown up by now.

          • Ever read ,”Red Star Over Hollywood”? I don’t know where you receive your propaganda, but the Communist and Socialist Parties are alive and well in the US. There are admitted members in congress. Look it up. Both heavily fund the Dumba$$oc RAT party. I believe you knew this but either, didn’t want to admit it or are sweeping these facts under the rug. Viet Nam was , I believe Kennedy’s and Johnson’s fiasco. Who got us out? Nixon? Which pres. promised to end wars (unilaterally, That doesn’t work, It’s silly)? Which president sent missiles and bombs into more different countries than ever before? Which president has been in office the longest with the US at war? Is it the same one who “Blew” the victory earned in Iraq? Your arguments are, sadly, bereft of common sense. Defending incompetence is shameful. Socialism / Communism only works well for those at the top of the party, just like the Dumba$$ocrat party system.

          • There was a time, in the 1930s, before Stalin and during the rise of Fascism when the Communists were leading an heroic fight for democracy in Spain. The democratically elected government had been overthrown by Franco, a fascist dictator, with help from the Nazis and the Catholic Church.
            Many brave people from the artistic world, writers, actors, painters, poets, and film makers, whent there to fight against the Fascists. In doing so they often united with Communists who were the most effective faction in that fight.
            Remember, this was before the evils of Communism were well known, and there were powerful communist groups agitating in most European countries.
            At that time it seemed to many to be a good idea to give the communists support, and even to join the party.

            Later, after WWII the USA went fanatically anti communist and the Cold War era began. Communists were then our legitimate enemy but many people had a history of supporting communists from the old pre WWII era.
            Anti-Communist fanatics like senator Jow McCarthy locked onto this and confince the government through a corrupt FBI to go in a witch hunt to find and persecute these people.
            The result were hearings that brought great disgrace on the US Government. As wikipedia says:
            “McCarthyism is the practice of making accusations of subversion or treason without proper regard for evidence.[1] It also means “the practice of making unfair allegations or using unfair investigative techniques, especially in order to restrict dissent or political criticism.”[2] The term has its origins in the period in the United States known as the Second Red Scare, lasting roughly from 1950 to 1956 and characterized by heightened political repressionagainst communists, as well as a campaign spreading fear of their influence on American institutions and of espionage by Soviet agents. Originally coined to criticize the anti-communist pursuits of Republican U.S. SenatorJoseph McCarthy of Wisconsin, “McCarthyism” soon took on a broader meaning, describing the excesses of similar efforts. The term is also now used more generally to describe reckless, unsubstantiated accusations, as well as demagogic attacks on the character or patriotism of political adversaries.”
            So I don’t need to read how modern right wing fanatics want to resurrect this disgraceful practice because it is good for their electoral prospects.

            I repeat, there is no subversive communist activity going on in the USA. Communist ideopogy is totally discredited and dead. It will never be seen again in a meaningful way in the USA because no one want it.
            I know you lovbe to be scared, but I hate it and I am repelled by those who try to scare me, especially with these very tired old red under the bed tactics.

          • Are you posting that , there is no Socialist Party or Communist Party active today that (both) fund the Dumba$$oc RAT Party? Is that what you are writing? REALLY? Cloward and Piven. Van Jones ex activist working for (in) this white house is an admitted Commie.

          • No. You can still find some vestigial organisations around uniting some sad old tragics who are trying to keep alive the best aspects of socialism, and even communism. These outfits are still trying to morph into modern centrist democratic momement like those that can be found in Europe.
            I don’t think that they will ever be successful, but it would not be such a bad thing if one of them did succeed in reforming the Democratic Party.
            Workers still need to be defended against employers who will unfairly exploit them and subject them to unsafe work places. Unions can do bad things sometimes and so they need to be controlled by a strong an democratic political party. We don’t have that now.
            So I am not shocked if someone in the Administration admits that they are a communist. We are now an intelligent plural society that can handle a diversity of views about society and policy and econiomics.

          • So, you don’t know of Cloward and Piven. What is happening here for 60+ yrs is their plan. Played out by Dumba$$oc RATS., subverting the system. Look it up. Hellary and Oblablabla are Alinskyites. How come you don’t know this stuff?

          • “So, you don’t know of Cloward and Piven.
            ——————–
            Yes I know of it. I agree with the account posted here.
            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloward%E2%80%93Piven_strategy
            I think this was a naive academic strategy designed to achieve social policy changes through the Democratic Party. Of course the conservatives jumped on it as incipient socialism.

            It was, but it is fine by me to try to reform our inefficient welfare system which delivers very poor bang for the buck.
            What is your problem?

          • Taking down the American system is what I have a problem with. Too bad you don’t. Welfare should be for the handicapped, not breeders and paid voters. Redistribution is UN AMERICAN.

          • I agree. If you look at all my posts you will find that my consistent theme has been that our country is not ruined. We have some problems, but we are smart enough to fix them. That is why I am a progressive.
            Welfare should be for those who really need it. The problem is how to filter them out from those who don’t need it. The problem is not how to cut it down for all.
            Yes, re-distribution is un-American but that is a wrong and selfish way of looking at taxation fairness. It is proper policy to tax most those have gained most benefit from living and operating here and who can most afford it. People who benefit most from where our taxes go (the stability of this country, its educated healthy population, its infrastructure, law enforcement and its national security), are shareholders in the large businesses whose profits are tied to these things. It is appropriate that they should pay more tax to give back to us for giving them these benefits.
            The wealthy can take care of their tax obligations very well. They do not need our sympathy or support.

            Big business has somehow convinced conservatives to object to it paying its fair share of tax. I don’t understand how it did that.

          • When you’ve got people working in gummint offices with no accountability giving away other people’s money, they’ll do it for the party that has created their job. Easy to understand that. That also gets them job security. Who says “It’s proper tax policy”? , you and the dumba$$oc RATS? Those lying cheating stealing scammers have the system set up so that some families go for generations defying free education and never having a job so they may “Sit” on welfare forever. Google New Orleans Entrepreneur obituary for Larmondo Allen, there’s thousands like him. They all vote for the Dumba$$oc RATS, and you know it. As the saying goes, everyone should have skin in the game. All should pay taxes, agreed tho that the poor should pay less. Would you admit that those able bodied folks on welfare their whole lives are actually the ones benefiting most. Big business gets it’s tax breaks because the states don’t want to lose the employment. Also businesses on Wall Street donate tons of cash to the Dumba$$oc RATS, who claim (lying) that they’re against big business. Hellary / Goldman Saks. It’s mostly the 2nd. Look up political donations of large corps. to political parties. Dumbos win big. It’s not the conservatives that get most of the $. That’s another LIE they tell folks like you cause you’ll believe ’em, sadly, without looking it up.

          • Small business actually employ more people than large corps. Sadly, it’s these small businesses that get screwed more by the Dumba$$oc RATS, no tax breaks,more regulations, health care mandates wage control, etc. These politicians have lied to you voters for generations and take advantage of you. With 47% of the population getting money from them the rest of us taxpayers lose. Too bad you and yours don’t understand that.

          • Google : Bill Whittle… “Death by Democrat”

          • Look KB. I could give you a lot of things to Google too, but I refuse to get caught up in the infantile conspiracies of the looney right.
            I understand that when you are so far to the right then everyone expressing a different view appears to be a leftist, commie, socialist. But really it is all in your mind.

            You need to exercise more critical thinking in your reading. I suggest that you should start by learning about the logical fallacies and work up from there. Be very careful who you listen to on websites like this one. You can escape from this quagmire if you try hard enough.

            For what it is worth, I am not a Democrat voter but I suppose that you assume that anyone who is not of the rabid right must be a damn Lib’rul and a Democrat. The real world is a lot more complicated and wonderful than that.

          • you seem to be low info. voter. That’s why I try to find out where you get your propaganda and how much (little) you know. Have you heard of Cloward and Piven?

          • After what came out today from State Dept., Hellary used private server illegally (had sensitive data on it ), hid and destroyed evidence, then lied to Congress about it, what would you think if Justice Dept. was directed by, You – know – who, to not indict?

          • If Sec Clinton reallly committed a serious crime with her e-mail, she shouild be prosecuted for it and, if found guilty, that should prevent her from becoming President. I hope that does not happen because she is still a much better candidate than her Republican opposition.

            I don’t like her personality much and I don’t doubt that she has done some dishonorable things, but I am sufficiently objective to see that she ran State very well and I understand that is excellent preparation for the role of President. I would much prefer her if the alternative is that narcissistic real-estate salesman.

            I believe that President Hillary would not be great. It would be steady as she goes for two terms with nothing terribly good or bad happening. We could do better, but I am ready for that.

          • You missed it again, waltzing around my question, pretending, I think, cause you do not want to directly answer it. The question was really more about the pres. directing the Dept. of Just. to not act in the face of this devastating info. If you are a woman, how do you feel about Hellary actions in the taking down of HillBilly’s numerous women? You’ve heard of the “Bimbo eruptions” that she had Blumenthal, etc, smear, intimidate defame and have pets killed. You do know this harridan despises the military, don’t you?What foreign country has a better relationship with the US since her time at State? Which have worse? You do know she was actually fired from her 1st gummint job for lying and hiding/destroying evidence , don’t you? Her college ,I believe, dissertation was some 80 pages on the positive benefits of Saul Alinsky. He was a commie intent on destroying the US. She ordered the college to SEAL that paper. Gee, Wonder why? You don’t have enough info to hold onto your leftist beliefs if you really are a service vet. I expect better.

          • No. I don’t KNOW all those negative things about Mrs Clinton. I don’t believe them by default and Occama Razor. The simplest explanation for them is probably right. They are simply political attacks of the dirtiest kind.

            I have confidence in the system, and I don’t care much if she is indicted, unless there is no one in place who could do better than her. So far I don’t see anyone.

            Australia and the UK have a better relationship with us due to her diplomacy. They hated W.
            I know wnough about college undergrad assignments to not place much weight on her dissertation. What were the terms of the assignment. Often as student must make a case for something that they don’t believe in. I presume that she sealed it because of people like you who don’t understand these things and would put it in the worst possible light.

            I am not a combat veteran. I served as a junior engineering officer (JG) on a very old destroyer that never went anywhere particularly dangerous while I was on board. The Navy was my grandfather’s fantasy, not mine. It gave me a good education, I served my obligation time and enjoyed it, and then I got a better job.

            I have never actually held any leftist beliefs. I understand what that means, but mine are centrist incremental progressive. Do you know what that means?

          • I know you are a progressive. I’d think you’d want to know more about the lying, thieving crook before you voted for her. Sadly, her backers don’t care about her character either, only about what she’ll give ’em.

          • I don’t play the game that your conservative overlords inflict on you: Google researching among their ridiculous evidence of presidential impropriety.

            Conservatives tend to be like evangelicals. They have to have holy scripture that they can tie their beliefs to. I am more like Tom Jefferson and Ben Franklin: enlightened, questioning, and skeptical.

            For me the best outcome we can expect from this election is a battle between Mrs Clinton and Mr Trump which she wins. Then the Republican Party will self destruct and perhaps what replaces it will be much better. It can’t get much worse than it is now.

          • You are delusional. Get more info before you make unsubstantiated comments. Your ridiculous opinions are useless.

          • Come on KB! You can do better than that, can’t you?
            At least my opinions are my own, and informed by independent critical thinking.

          • I refuse to get torqued up by all the anti Obama nonsense you find on conservatives websites like this one. It is all made up, but it isrepeated so often that it acquires a life of its own. If it is sensational and it is not repeated by the mainstream media, then it is always bullshit. Journalists have ethics too, not many but some,
            The default position must always be disbelief.
            I don’t understand why am intelligent fellow jike you can be such a sucker for that obvious pap.

          • Please don’t tell me you believe the main stream media. I’ve watched it for 50+ yrs. Most of them actually admit their liberal bias. Do you ever wonder why CBS, ABC and CBS have given almost no time to the scandalous way the health care bill was passed or Hillary’s email and Benghazi scandal and the succeeding ,”Cover up” lies? Sadly, like the NY Times they filter and only release stuff that agrees with their liberal agenda.Liberals I know, have even agreed to that. I actually use several sources for my information, including the 3 Sun. AM main stream fake news.

          • Do you know of “Fast and Furious” the illegal gun running operation run by E. Holder and Obama? Do you know of Philip Hanan’s research? Please comment on these two scandals.

          • Thank you for your contribnution. Yes that is a very good example of what I am talking about.

            In this case the ATF ran a covert operation aimed at tracking illegal gun traffickling acrioss our southern border. The criminals were allowed to purchase some guns which were bugged with trackers and the idea was to follow them closely so that evidence could be obtained against the big players involved. Obviously catching the fall guys with the guns would not achieve very much. The investigation had to get to the source and destination players.
            When the operation leaked, questions were asked of the Administration, and those responsible, including Holder and Obama refused to comment on it or to provide documents.

            There would have been no need for them to think about this before giving an automatic response. This is normal practice for covert operations. There are usually agents whose lives will be in danger if names or other details find their way to the criminals. This kind of thing is very common and the response must always bee the same.

            The right wing bullshit artists know this very well, because they would be the first to complain if any officials blew the operation and some good guys were killed. But now they have an opportunity to exclaim “cover up”, and to imply that our trusted officials must have been involved in the gun running and are now desperately trying to withhold evidence.

            This is a classic example of a very old spin tactic. It usually works because the target audience is naive conservatives. Evidence of this is the way the NRA has promoted this dastardly act by our gun-hating president.
            https://www.nranews.com/series/cam-and-company/video/how-were-the-fast-and-furious-documents-released/episode/cam-and-company-season-10-episode-228

            I could not find anything on Philip Hanan’s research. I presume you are not takling about the dead ArchBishop?

          • Hanan had devoted years (working inside the government) to research mosques with questionable ties to islamic terrorists in the US. This administration had the info. destroyed supposedly, because it wouldn’t look good for Obama’s immigration(of muslims) plans. The info included the Tsarnaev bros. and the San Bernadino couple. Hanan said ,if his info was used, probably many lives could’ve been saved. Are you pleased with the Bergdahl prisoner exchange and the release from Gitmo, the terrorists responsible for ( your service branch) the USS COLE bombing? Your answer oughta be a good one. The gun running initiated thru Holder was a disastrous fiasco. I’m surprised he could find his gender specific bathroom. I think you’d have a different opinion of these many examples of screw ups, lies, irresponsible conduct and unqualified leadership, if a loved 1 of yours was victimized. I don’t agree with any of your justifications.

          • Officials are not allowed to create private shit file databases using their privileged access to government intelligence. That is a crime and any data so collected must be destroyed. Why don’t you know this?

            I think GITMO is a national disgrace, and everyone held there should be given a fair trial and released if not convicted. I also do not believe that foreigners, when outside the USA, can break US laws, because the US has no jurisdiction to make laws governing non-Americans operating in other countries. Similarly, Americans cannot be thrown into prison in some Arab shit-hole failed state because, while working in the USA, they broke some law of that country.

            What happened to the USS Cole was a tragedy that should have been avoided. The USN knows that it must maintain extreme vigilance when operating in a harbour in Yemen. The place has no law enforcement and is full of religious fanatics; terrorists; drug criminals; and pirates. All the locals are openly hostile to US sailors in the streets.
            Under those circumstances an unknown boat should not have been allowed to come alongside.

          • Apparently you didn’t look it up and have no concern to find the truth about the prevaricator in chief. It was not a private database. You are an apologist, waltzing around the questions with Josh Earnest -like dishonesty. Shame on you. Gitmo is used so we don’t have to bring the worst of the worst here and provide them with lawyers and The rights , they scream for . These scum bag dress wearing murderers have it too good already. Your opinion about the USS cole doesn’t mean $hit. I asked you about releasing those responsible. Your claimed ignorance of Bergdahl scandal is your shortcoming. I’ve seen numerous interviews with his fellow troops, all who claim he deserted and was responsible for the deaths of those who looked for him. That is dishonorable and for you to continue to defend the lying A$$hole in charge is also. Shame on you again. I know several other retired military and they completely disagree with you. The exchange was 5 “Generals” for 1 deserter. That’s aiding the enemy in time of war. Look it up.

          • I ignored you about Bergdahl because I have no reliable knowledge of his case. It looks to me like he deserted and should be court marshaled. I will refrain from making up my mind about his guilt until the outcome is known. There could be other explanations for his behaviour, such as insanity. We just don’t know.
            The real problem with Gitmo is that we just don’t know what they actually did. We may know what they have been accused of, but that is just not enough in our system of justice. I have no love for terrorists, but when we barge in on the end of a civil war and start making accusations about certain individuals intent to harm Americans, I have grave doubts about our assumptions of guilt. The Hicks case is an example of how we got it terribly wrong.
            I do know something about the obligations of the duty watch in dangerous ports. I have commanded a guard in that situation, although it was not nearly as hostile a place as Yemen. The ship is accountable for its own protection.
            It was an obvious target.
            Obama is not responsible for any of those things. Things happen on his watch sometimes. He is not the micro-manager of the nation’s defence. It is just that those who are fanatically opposed to him search for anything they can blame him for.
            He is the President, he is black and he understands the Muslim faith. Tha is useful, and he has done a pretty good job as our CEO. Soon he will not be in that role and the person who replaces him may be much worse. Worry about that.

          • In the majority of your posts that you mention this president, you state his race. That is racist. He is a racist. He has driven a wedge between all races. He promised different, but like all lying Leftists he delivered Saul Alinsky’s and George Soros’s version of heavy handed Socialist/Communist big centralized government control of bathrooms to Drs. examination rooms. The policies this fool crams down America’s craw, are not beneficial. He’s weakened our economy, healthcare, respect for the police (Law and Order), our borders , our military and relations with allies, while strengthening our enemies. His idiotic policies ( no consideration of unintended consequences) have hurt a cross section of American citizens. The poor and minorities have actually been hurt the most. Average incomes down between 5 – 10 % (among lower earners) less employed, more on welfare, still over 10 million with no health care. His MAJOR SCAMS, Green energy cost the US over $1.5 billion, and Healthcare (Both huge LIES), turned out to be money laundering scams used to fund Dumba$$oc RAT candidates. LOOK IT UP !! I have many minority clients/customers who I treat extremely well, who come back and refer family and friends. However, I don’t LIE to them in order to ingratiate myself or keep power. The policies of Dumba$$oc RATS have been more harmful to minorities as they’ve KEPT them dependent on GUMMINT and encourages broken families (Infidelity). That results in an absence of incentive and punishes the successful. If you do not understand this, You are beyond help, a pathetic leftist apologist. Don’t bother with your generic Dumba$$oc RAT talking points. They’ve only exposed you. Many surveys result in this unqualified pretender as being the ABSOLUTE WORST president ever. The only one’s happy about that stat. are the Jimmy Carter family. This jerk is a complete and utter FAILURE.

          • “In the majority of your posts that you mention this president, you state his race. That is racist. He is a racist. He has driven a wedge between all races. ”
            ————————-
            No, it is not racist to note that our president is a black man and to imply that this could be a problem for him and the nation at times. We have a sad history of racism in this country that makes his election highly notible in this respect, and it would be most extraordinary if his race was irrelevent. Mr Obama has acknowledged this that the USA is nowhere near sufficently advanced yet to make race an irrelevant consideration.
            We are being tested on our ability to control our inate racism, and most of us are passing that test. Shame about the far right.

            What is totally racist is to try to shut someone up because they consider this highly significant fact about our president relevant in a discussion about his performance.
            Obama certainly has not driven a wedge between all races in our plural American society. Most of them see his election as a positive development. Some are upset that he has not done more for their particular group. Others understand that the is the president of all Americans and do not expect him to do that.

            Some, on the far right, who are desperate do discredit him in any way that they can, will try to use his race against him. No one is perfect, but I believe that Barack Obama has a better appreciation of the problems of racism than any other president we have ever had, and that to a significant degree this is because he is a black man.

          • Don’t you see how goofy that statement is? People who continually bring up race, call others racist. I don’t dislike this incompetent lying fool because he’s black. I didn’t like HillBilly Clinton, either, because he is a cheating liar with no character. I don’t like these 2 morons because their policies hurt hard working tax paying Americans, in favor of slackers, leaches, frauds, criminals, scam artists and crooked politicians. This president has actually , as you posted, shut up opposition by locking them out of the room when the health care bill was being jiggered, remember? Do you know how many HIGH military career officers he’s “shut up” by firing or retiring? Black folks would think he’s doing a good job, cause they have to. From days ago, why wouldn’t you show your transcripts/grades? In my experience, of many professionals, those who are proud of ’em, display ’em,

          • No. You played the racism card first.
            I think locking right wing nutters out of the room when you are trying to achieve something is probably wise.

            Senior officers resign all thetime because they tend to get better offers from military suppliers. Some of them use this as an opportunity to hit back at their betters.

            I don’t think that army officers necessarily have a better view od what needs to be done than the Commander in Chief. It is all about intelligence reports, diplomatic feelers, advice from State, resources, political and economic considerations etc. The military probably do know best about how to win a war, but that is not always the prime consideration.

            I think we can relax about the quality of Obama’s education. Harvard Law does not employ non achievers as professors.

          • Apparently they do , especially when using racial preferences instead of grade point avg. and test scores. I saw it at my professional school. Sadly, this negatively effects the patients treated by the incompetents. Dumbing down society is not a good idea. It goes against American ideals. Do you think he used intelligence when the Iran Nuc. deal was made. The administration admitted they LIED about it, like they did the health care bill. Shameful.

          • Yes I know. There is a school of thought to which I am totally opposed, that says that unfairness in the past should be remedied by unfairness in the present: i.e two wrongs make a right. We treated blacks very unfairly in the past, but we should not now try to get their numbers up by giving them preference over others in education. Selection should be on merit, self discipline, and ability applied equally to all comers.

          • Wow, 2 in a row. Too bad the Dumba$$oc RAT Party would rather pay for votes with their racist policies. I think $60 trillion has been wasted on poverty programs since LBJ. What a colossal failure for American society, but a win for their party. It’ll only get worse unless this crap stops.

          • Yeah, both of our major parties are dreadful. I think that whichever one can reform itself first will do very well next time. My guess is that this will be the party that loses this election.

          • Remember, so0me lie about their heritage to get the racial preference favor to get into Harvard. That’s Elizabeth Warren, who now makes ~ $400 large and complains that Trump bought property on the cheap when housing crashed (because of Com Reinvest. Act, remember) when evidence shows she was flipping houses. That is blatant hypocrisy. And she complains of the high cost of college. What an IDIOT.

          • I think that is fair criticism. How to make the best of the national asset that is the talent pool of smart black people who cannot afford a tertiary education, is a subject that is well worth considering.

            I favor a generous scholarship system, tied to academic performance (but not in sport), available to all, but means tested to family income, and certainly not related to race. Any failures will result in loss of the scholarship for any further study. That would ensure that our federal tertiary education spending goes to those who can cope with tough study and assessment and who have the necessary self discipline.

          • Holy crap Batman, We agree.

          • We are really not so far apart KB.

            Much of what the looney right says is just common sense, but often it is presented as profound wisdom, and without much understanding of all the implications for the nation in the longer term. The other side would do all that too, if it could without creating more problems. The right is very frustrated that no one else believes its scandal mongering

            The center is not much better, but usually it is more informed on policy (not on scandals), and it does understand that if our country is to be restored to greatness, it will need to involve all of its talented people. This means providing opportunity and pulling people out of poverty. There is still a lot of greed and foolishness among the politicians of the center.

            We could use a party of the left to restore balance. There is no need to fear socialist policy. We are smart enough to use it where it is appropriate and to make it work as it should. Of course we would need tofire a lot of senior public service administrators and lazy government workers to do that.

          • Like I wrote before, the looney left creates problems by not thinking of the unintended consequences. Pointing out unlawful acts and corruption is not scandal mongering. Talented people must get themselves involved. That’s not governments job. Equal opportunity is not (as you agreed) special preferences. Example…. Professional sports. Greed, or getting ahead, is the incentive that brings out the best in people. The cream will rise to the top. It always has. However what rises is not always the cream. Why not Cadillacs for all? And free vacations for all? Work and earn your own benefits, including health care, unless you’re disabled. Socialism has failed miserably in most large countries. Venezuela, USSR, Cuba, etc. What do you think of gummint officials picking and choosing which statutory laws they enforce, especially ones that have been proven to cause physical harm, even death to American citizens? What about federal officials breaking laws for political reasons?

          • Have you given consideration to the administration’s admitted lying to the public to pass the health care law and the Iran Nuclear deals? Check out Mark Dubowitz and also, Bill Whittle’s “Death by Democrat” Tell me what you think. Thanks.

          • No. It doesn’t bother me much. I want Obamacare to suceed.
            Officials say the wrong thing in media interviews. It happens all thetime. Its hard to handle tricky queation under pressure. Both sides do it. Remember Iran Contra?
            Not interested in reading political hacks. I don’t like to be manipulated by people like that. I don’t have time for that endless google research game. I am too skeptical.

          • Too bad, one cannot form intelligent opinions without getting ALL the facts.The lame stream media filters and only pushes their leftist agenda.
            I watch it too.

          • True, but it is a lot of trouble to find unbiased sources for all the facts. I would only bother if it were very important to me. Don’t kid youselt that the media of the right is any more ethical than that of the center. Fox News and most of the radio commentators are a disgrace to their profession. I suppose they are at least more open about being totally biased.

            I hate the way those shock jocks insult my intelligence with their shoddy commentary and scare tactics.

            At least the center media is more subtle about that, and treats me as an ethical, critical person who can think for himself. I also like the way that they mostly ignore the scandal mongering and character assassinations of the right. You would have to admit that they have much better manners.

          • Ben Rhodes and jon. Gruber did not “Say the wrong things” answering trick questions, they openly were bragging about how this corrupt administration lied to the American people to further their political agenda. If you believe that exposing scandal is “Mongering” and worse than creating scandal, you are not a patriotic American, honest or very bright. You have been manipulated by the left and don’t even know it. Or you are an operative. HA HA What was the motive / expected gain,profit for Iran Contra? What are the motives / expected gain, profits for Green energy businesses, health care, sanctuary cities and illegal immigration and Iran nuclear deal? Answer those honestly.

          • OK KB. You are very concerned about political lies and you are angry with me for not being like that. After all, so much conservative criticism depends on detecting deplorable lies that I have no right to disempower you in that way. Well, It may take a lot of words, but I like you now, and I think it is time I explained my feelings about lies.
            Let’s define the term first. In my world lies are statements that the speaker knows are untrue. This may include, professional lies (advertising) myths, legends, half truths, assumptions,marketing, statistics, insincerity, politeness, election campaigns, religious preaching, history, economics, diplomacy, and even science.

            Lies are everywhere and everyone tells them: friends, lovers, rivals, clergymen, politicians, salesmen, broadcasters, newspapers, patriots, generals, children and computers. My metaphor is that we must live our lives knee-deep in a sewage of lies. This level has risen up from our shins during the last century because of the advent of the electronic media and the need to fund it from commercials, and even from advertising inserted into what is presented as news and entertainment.
            Our free enterprise representative democratic society gives rise to a few inches of the lie sewage level because of the need for highly contested regular elections, between candidates that are really quite similar.

            I have found a way to hold my nose and survive in this stinky environment. What I do is look for the underlying good in people and in institutions: considering the ideology that drives them, their history of achievement and their stated goals and objectives. I will give you two important examples.

            There is no doubt that the Democratic Party is rooted in the criminality of New York City in the 19th and early 20th centuries. Its leading members have committed many crimes, and no doubt lied their heads off about them at various times. Nevertheless, the teeming immigrant and black communities of NYC forced that Party to take account of the needs of the millions of poor and struggling citizens who were desperately trying to better themselves. That Party was reshaped by a great civil war and was forced to develop a social conscience. It aligned itself with workers and their unions who were fighting for better pay and safer conditions that were much needed and deserved. In doing so, it came up against vested interests who needed cheap pliable workers and low or no regulation. So that became the battleground for American politics.

            Now, I have to look at both sides and try to decide which one has the stench that bothers me the least. With the present choices, I have to go Democrat, knowing full well that it has not yet adequately reformed itself from the bad old days. To do otherwise would be to support an increasingly unequal society that will eventually tear this wonderful country apart. I wish there were a better choice, but there isn’t.

            In order to fully illustrate my point I need to use another example, and I apologize in advance if what I say next offends you. Conservative Americans tend to be deeply religious Christians. My own way is to feel that there is a profound truth and source of excellence and good in the universe that supports a belief in Christianity. Churches and organized religion have dressed that up in a plethora of well-intended medieval myths that no longer stack up for a modern well educated Americans. Essentially, it is a structure of lies that is no longer needed by intelligent people, and that is becoming more obvious to most people every day and organizes religion is feeling very threatened by our increasingly secular society. For me, these Biblical lies are is not so important. They add an inch or two to the now knee-deep lie sewage that I must live in, but I am used to that.
            So I don’t expect anyone to tell me the truth and I am not shocked when that does not happen. I am pleasantly impressed sometimes when I do hear the truth. I know that there is very little absolute truth other than raw facts, the truth of which is blatantly obvious.
            I included science above in my definition of lies very reluctantly because, although science does get it wrong sometimes, it has an effective system for rooting out mistakes, and it always strives for the truth. I love science,and I regard it as our only hope for draining the lie sewer.

            Of course you may think this is probably all lies, and I would sincerely respect that view.

          • You didn’t mention lies by political leaders that redistribute working taxpayers money to the idlers and lazy, or put lives in peril. Why? Justification because the other guy did it is a failed concept. Wasn’t it actually the Southern Democrats who discriminated against the blacks and they fled North to escape that In the North the white (Democrat, again) unions were formed to prevent these blacks from “Taking” their jobs. It was the republican party that freed them and wanted them to keep their families together and support themselves. In fact (Look it up) it was the republican party who had the majority of votes for civil rights, REMEMBER? Religion has been used to create a moral foundation , societal rules. It is the people ,themselves who are guilty of sin and law breaking. I do expect the truth from people, but not too surprised when I don’t get it. Science is based on truth and data, results. When people lie about this to push their political agenda, extorting or confiscating others hard earned $, that should be punished severely. Check out the latest global warming stats. I don’t think you’re lying, just a bit misinformed. I wonder where you grew up and got your early and even later education as you are very articulate. Loving science, how do you feel about “The argument is over” attitude, when you know that scientific data comes in always and forever and should be “Truthfully” analyzed?

          • Of course it is lies like that which make my lie sewage smell so bad. I also hate it when the government wastes huge sums supporting private enterprise, particularly big corporations supplying the military. That sometimes endangers lives too.

            The debate about who freed the slaves could go on forever. As I tried to explain, I prefer to think about who wanted to do that, and who was forced to do that. There were plenty of racists on both sides. That was 19th century USA, and neither modern political party can pretend otherwise.

            No argument is ever over in science, but the case for the warming atmosphere across the globe has been made very scientifically in a great variety of unconnected ways using excellent and expensive science – and it has certainly not been refuted scientifically, only politically. The debate about whether this warming is caused by humans and, if so, whether the effect can be reversed, is more interesting now and not yet settled by science.

            The latter question is becoming a matter for economists to judge, and I do not regard economists as scientists. I think that the logical wager favors trying to reverse it, because we might succeed, and then the reward could be as infinitely high as the survival of the human species. The consequence of failure through not trying is unthinkable. Then the human species would not deserve to survive. The price we would pay for trying and failing could be very high. and may affect some countries more than others. At least we may prolong our survival for a while and clean our nest up a bit.

          • Ha, hopefully we are the last species. Remember this, with the military contracts, we do get high tech weapons , needed in this terrible world we live in . Russia moving on the Ukraine, China into the Pacific ISIS Al Quaida,etc., N. Korea and Iran nuclear weapon threats. I agree there is probably a lot of wasted $. However we do get something we need. The Green Energy programs that went bankrupt (some expectedly, actually forecast to do so 1 yr. prior) was a money laundering scam directly into Dumba$$oc RAT campaigns. You do know that, don’t you? That was a bald faced lie and cost ~$580 million.as was the bungled roll out of Oblablabla care. The company that got that ~$580 million (again) was run by friends of Michelle. Remember? I saw several computer geeks interviewed who said that could have been done correctly for under $10 million. No way to prove that up, tho. Then the same “Friends” got ,I think another $75 million to fix it., HA HA HA I don’t know why I’m laughing, it isn’t funny. Again, on both sides, it’s the people who are corrupt that mess things. I still believe in the system where delivering a product , putting people to work is better than lies money laundering and thievery.

          • I don’t have to go that far!!…….. You didn’t lose your plan or your dr.

          • Actually, I did… The HMO that I was going to for a long time was not a choice on our “New” plans. So I was forced to move. I live in CA. My Governor is far more socialists than yours.

            My Premiums went up, my copays skyrocketed, and now I have a minimum yearly deductible on top of my weekly tax fines.

            Large Employers are exempt till well after the zero is out of office… 0bama is a chicken.

            I suppose you are one of the fools that still believes the lies Gruber put out. When Gruber called Americans STUPID, he was not talking about me… He was talking about the stupid American voters that bought the same crap that you now spew…

            Why should we believe you any more than any other politician lying about 0bamacare…

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Adrdmmh7bMo

          • Again, your employer screwed you.

            ACA was set up for folks who did not have insur thru their employer. Since yours decided to canc your group plan I do know CA had many options on your state exchange. You had to do some homework to match your needs/budget. If what you chose is not working out ” open enrollment” happens every fall. You can re-evaluate and chose a plan that works better for you and your family. I would even help you.

          • NO ACA screwed me…. If it were not for ACA, the employer would not have changed.

            When we matched our needs to our budget, we lost on both ends…. We lost our Dr. We lost our Health Care Plan, and we paid more for the choices we had….

            All three of those things were promised by 0bama… 0bama lied, the people that wrote the plan lied from the insurance company lied, and the people that continue to spread lies and deception are lying the same way Gruber lied to the American People.

            ACA is an oxymoron and always has been. It was designed to fail, designed to enslave people, which in turn, HURTS more people than it benefits.

          • Wrong, I didn’t lose my plan, my dr or my insur from my employer and neither did millions of Americans, especially red state governors… They just screwed the folks in their state, like you. ……but it’s obvious you are to ignorant to understand the explanation. ACA is doing just fine. And those of us with smart employers did not lose anything. Your employer DID NOT have to give up the health insurance he/she was providing you. That was their CHOICE. When you then enrolled in ACA it was your CHOICE to chose a good match for your family, obviously you didn’t. If your governor did not do an exchange you only had 4 choices all with up front deductiable…… Move or get out of the way as progress is running right over you.

            Anthem health insur, as an example, is doing so well with ACA enrollment, meaning lots of premiums across this country, since 2010, their stock price went from $55 a share to $130 plus a share.

            You lost!!!!! ACA is here to stay!!!!

          • What kind of animal are you?

            This is not a game where the Government wins, and the people win.. The people loose every time the Government expands..

            While you CLAIM millions have won, it is obvious that hundreds of millions have lost. The people lost, Liberty lost.

            ACA is just another step towards socialism… Where everybody is a slave.

            Do your happy dance, ugly one.

        • Sure and (in my case) after a $1,000 a month premium and $6,000 deductible THEN it will pay a percentage for me to see a doctor. Oh, and my company weny with an Obamacare plan, I lost four of my five doctors. I’m supposed to be impressed? This law is a joke.

          • You need to scream at your employer, they screwed you. You also must live in a red state….. Too bad. Republican governors are the joke and they made you all the butt of the joke.

            My employer did not send us to our state exchange. They kept our company plan intact and in fact they gave us more options. My portion of the premium is $180 a month. I do not have a deductiable for my yearly physical ( and neither do you, because of ACA). I have a $25 copay for any other dr ofc visits and my doc of 20 years is in network. I/p hosp is a zero deductiable. I also have dental/rx/vision.

      • StupidConservativeValues

        Is that what you’ve told yourself when you cannot connect with whatever you’re attracted to sexually?

      • In this case federal grants were being offered to improve health care. They came with strings attached that implemented Obamacare. The idea of providing universal access to health insurance was very good in principle. It promised to allowed us all to be personally responsible to manage the risk of becoming financially destitute if a member of our family had a health breakdown or an accident. This makes sense, and is proper business practice applied to personal risk.

        Conservatives did their best to protect the profitability of the HMOS, because that is obviously much more important than our financial security. So we wound up with a bill that had many flaws, including the ones mentioned above. The challenge now is to fix it. Not to get rid of it.

        I care about the profitability of HMOs every bit as much as they care about my financial security.

        • I say start over… First impeach anyone that voted for 0bamacare before they read it, and then, reduce the regulations that strangle the entire industry…

          Get the corrupt Government out of our Health Care.

          Just my opinion, you can not FIX something that started out so corrupt to begin with.

          • I would prefer the government to run health care rather than our greedy HMOs.

            Obamacare started out as a Republican policy in several states.

          • The problem with our health care system is the collusion of Big Government and Big Business. That is not Capitalism, that is NOT what Republicans stand for either.

            Republican Politicians = Democrat Politicians = Elite MEDIA = Communists.

            Crony Capitalism = Crony Socialism = Communism…. Look into it… The collusion of Big Government and Big Business is at the core of the VERY definition of Communism…

            Our Political system has been taken over by Communists. The elites have controlled things for quite some time now…

            The reason the Health Care system is so important to the Politicians is because it IS control over the people.

            The Democrats passed this law without ANY support of the Republicans… Politicians modified the Romney bill to an unrecognizable pile of crap that it is today.

            I have no clue how you have been lead to believe that this monstrosity is the Republicans fault…. I guess to you everything is the Republicans fault.

            Having said that, I fault the Republican politicians for not fighting hard enough to stop it.

            In short, you prefer to live under Communism, as the socialists that have convinced you that this form of Government know that socialism always falls to Communism. And that Communism, always has a DICTATOR, and those DICTATORS ALWAYS exterminate those that oppose their rule…..

          • Wrong! American Conservatives talk about Communism all the time but they simply don’t ubnderstand what it is. Essentially, Communists believe that the means for production should be in the hands of the people; through their government usually, but never through big business. No true Communist wants any big business at all.

            There are no real communists left today. The title is now merely a mis-aimed insult for ignorant conservatives to throw at anyone they don’t like or understand.

          • You are WRONG! And you call me ignorant…… From the dictionary

            Communism – Marxist-Leninist system.
            the Marxist-Leninist version of a classless society in which capitalism is overthrown by a working-class revolution that gives ownership and control of wealth and property to the state.

            Socialism – Political system of communal ownership
            a political theory or system in which the means of production and distribution are controlled by the people and operated according to equity and fairness rather than market principles

            In Communism the means for production is in the hands of the STATE! NOT the People, that is socialism.

            Socialism doesn’t exist, and never will until EVIL people (read dictators) are removed from Earth…

            Here are the facts Jack… Socialism always falls to Communism…

            “The goal of Socialism is Communism.”
            —-Lenin

            You really should understand something a little better if you are going to call them stupid…. Think before you post moron.

          • Mah’ Congratulations on your Googling. Generally that is correct so you should study it a bit more before rabbiting on about evil communists. Better to do that than tio rely on your ignorant assumptions.
            What do you think that the Russians had before they went communist? It was a brutal feudal society run by a tyrannical Czar. Communism was a huge improvement, and that is why it was such a popular movement. You would have been with them with your gun if you had lived there then. If not you wouls have been a royalist fighting to preserve the Czar. There were no American democrats in Russia then.

            Soci9alism is a title given by ignorant American conservatives to hatefully describe certain forms of public policy that deny revenues to private enterprise by allowing the people and their government to run things like education, health and infrastructure. It usually comes with a more generopus welfare system.

            Such socialist policies work very well in many countries along with capitalist policies for other things. These countries are usually a better place for poor people tio live than is the USA.

          • I didn’t google anything for my comment above, I used the definitions found in the Microsoft word dictionary.

            The only problem with googling is that history from Wikipedia can not be trusted. All dictators control history through the written word… Nor can trending in Fakebook apparently.

            Communism is popular because all the dissidents are exterminated…. How many Dissidents in those societies had a bullet put through their heads thought they were fighting for the czars, or were they simply fighting for freedom? Purging of that nature tends to leave only those in favor of the movements.

            I don’t think you know squat about the “socialists” societies that you idealize…

            As Lenin said, “The goal of socialism is Communism.” True in his day, true today…

          • No need to apologize to me about using Wikipedia. It can be risky, but people who have learned how to think critically can handle it.

            No one controls history anymore. It is not like in the 5th grade where it was a serial collection of facts and dates. Now it is about published research examining contemporary sources, documents, records and taking account of economic, religious, cultural, and military events. Sure, it can be biased in interpretation, but this kind of material cannot be falsified. through a widespread conspiracy.

            I don’t “idolise socialism” I just do not have the fanatical hatred for it that you find among hard right wingers. Today it is just one trend in public policy, and I can see both the good and bad in it. Mankind was all socialist before civilization turned us into us haves and have-nots. It really works well in some situations. Conservatives can’t stand to hear that, but they need to understand, so I tell them often.

            You asked why I believe mainstream media. Well, I used to work for abc in a technical role, and so I understand how it works. It is an extremely competitive business that is constantly desperate to get a lead on an exclusive scoop. So, I just cannot imagine our TV networks or major newspapers ignoring a good evil-Obama story because it offends some liberal bias. They don’t reoport Tea Party propaganda because they know it is crap.

            Also, I have studied public policy at college level and the academecis there are absolutely ruthless against political bias. They are all necessarily very well informed on the subject called Comparative Public Policy. That is where they research the similarities and differences in policies and outcomes by many governments across the world. This subject shows very clearly what works and what does not work. Political bias is not only irrelevant, but is quite harmful to proper analysis of the data. Socialist policies in education, health and welfare are included with free enterprise, corporate and dictator policies. Outcomes are measured in un-arguable terms such as health and education statistics. Most developed countries do better than the USA, not only the socialist ones. We Americans can stuff up big time with private enterprise methods too: look at the HMOs, and exclusive private schools for example.
            The impact of all this is what you perceive to be the liberal bias in the mainstream media. It is really only the academic and international experience prevailing in a majority of sensible informed people over half-baked attempts at the assination of reputations that the ectreme conservatives try to serve up as political commentary.
            But you are right to some degree because the business school crowd have robbed this country of its best journalists. The necessary resources are no longer being provided to enable the kind of quality journalism that we used to enjoy. Some, like Fox News, have given up completely and no longer even claim to have journalists, only commentators. I actually get most of my news from international sources. There are plenty of websites that analyse US news in a thorough old fashioned style. My favourite one is the Australian ABC, and particularly its “Planet America” show.
            http://www.abc.net.au/news/programs/planet-america/

          • I don’t use Wikipedia, and don’t believe in Wikipedia. Not sure how you got that opinion.

            I think you are wrong about history as well, those that write history into history books control history, they can even rewrite it as what Wikipedia has proven.

            I you were part of the mainstream media you may not see the corruption within it. But you should know that ABC, NBC, and CBS all feed of the same “News” sources, and repeat the same stories.. The industry used to be competitive, now on the West Coast, they do not even broadcast during the same time slot. They are no longer competitors any more than brothers or sisters are, let me ask you this.. If one horse races on the East coast, and the other on the West coast, and during their lifetime they never compete on the same race track, do they compete against each other?

            There is a complete and total hypocrisy in the “News” MEDIA that you can not and will not see. I don’t know why, but it has to be something to the effect that when immersed in brown water, you can not see the color of the water. The MEDIA has been utterly complacent in tracking down and reporting stories that hurt liberal causes, and utterly complacent in tracking down and reporting stories that help conservative causes… Just like Facebook. It is called bias by omission, and to think that the practice is anything but on purpose is kind of ignorant and foolish.

            Again, you think the school system doesn’t have an agenda? Here is the thing, if the liberal progressives are outed as being biased, they loose all credibility, and their indoctrination policies will have little to no effect. I have read enough of your writing to see that all you attempt to do is gain credibility and trust then shove the same liberal progressive propaganda down your readers throat…

            Thanks for the civil minded indoctrination, but I do not buy it…. It is your incremental progressivism of always marching forward toward socialism and never admitting you are wrong that has backed conservatives into a corner.

            You see bias in Fox, yet not ABC, you see all things wrong with America’s Capitalism and nothing wrong with Communism. Broadcast journalism sold itself out during the Bush bashing years, and will never ever be equal when it comes to conservative politicians.

            .

          • Thank you. I sympathize with your frustration at the mainstream media, but I offer the consolation that I think your analysis may be flawed.
            The main problem is the lack of resources for making good news. To report in the old way, they had to hire large teams of quality journalists and resource them very well with production staff, wire services, travel, etc. That is very expensive and those that stopped doing it, to bolster they profits during a massive loss of readership revenues, prospered for a time. However, it was a race to the bottom, and now all the ones you mention (except ABC) are merely empty shells. Actually, abc (America) is just the same, but ABC (Australia) is a fine example of how this decline can be avoided. However the Aussie national broadcasting model is too complicated, and apparently socialist, for Americans to ever understand.

            The American media is actually still highly competitive in that there is a tough fight for any still-available audiences. Political scandals make excellent stories, especially if there is a chance of a scoop on the competition. The reason that the mainstream media do not jump on and repeat the wildest claims of the conservative media sites is that they usually simply don’t believe they are true. If they report them then their reputation is at stake. There is still sufficient vestigial journalistic integrity left in the old players for them to want to avoid trashing their reputation. Of course if your reputation is as bad as that of Rupert Murdoch and his trashy papers, then there is no such constraint.

            You are correct to judge me as an incremental progressive. Congratulations, because very few here have been so perceptive. I know you intended it as an insult, but I honestly believe we can do much better in a broad range of public policy areas: health; education; welfare; defense; transportation; infrastructure, etc. Unlike conservatives, I do not defend the status quo because I believe it can be improved by lots of small changes (incremental). One big change (rational) would often be quicker and cheaper, but Americans are far too conservative to handle that, and perhaps not sufficiently organized to achieve it. You see, I do not fear that all change is usually for the worse. I think Americans are smart and brave enough to manage change for the best.
            So you see “progressive” is praise for me. You need to find some skanky adjective to put in front of that word to properly express your disdain.

          • I don’t think my analysis about the “News” is flawed or wrong… abc, nbc, cbs, cnn, msnbc, espn, have formed a cabal, they use bias by omission to spin all news to fit a liberal progressive agenda.

            They no longer compete for resources, they use the same resources, the same stories, the same “news” feeds, even their programming has the same format 15 Min to open, 2 min commercial block, another story or two, 3 min commercial block, another quick story, sponsor with 2.5 more min of commercials, then closing story. The ads are the same, the stories are the same, the formats are the same…. They work in lockstep together… No longer competing.

            It is not their job to MAKE the news, it is their job to REPORT the news… It is their hypocrisy that exposes their agenda. Notice how all three quit reporting how many people died in the war the second 0bama took over? Or how they tore apart NJ trying to find where Christie lied about his Bridgegate, and glossed over Hillary’s and 0bama’s lies. What they are doing is herding their viewers to a controlled conclusion.

            I have nothing against progress. But I do have a great deal against progress that leads towards Communism… And that is where those that control the liberal progressives seem to be incrementally going. Liberal Progressives fit into one of two categories, either you are evil or you are lead by evil. History has shown that liberals are good people with good intentions, but are followers and easily mislead.

            Liberals are NOT holding their Controllers responsible for their lies… I guess that is up to Conservatives.

            How about Socialists/Communist Progressives…

          • Too bad you ALL don’t go live there.

          • Obamacare was patterned after a conservative plan originated by the Heritage Foundation!!! Romney used it the same heritage plan for romneycare in Massachusetts. Pres Obama tried to get GOP by-in by using the same plan as an outline for ACA. Repubs said “no” to their own idea!!!!!!!!!!

          • charles johnston

            If patterned on anything, why did the democrats let te insurance companies write it. . . with guarnteed profit built in? No wonder not one republican voted for it. They knew fron the outset it was a scam and destined to fail. That was the idea.

          • It wasn’t the same plan. Look it up you know nothing. . No education SAD. Any IDIOT can parrot Dumba$$oc RAT talking points. You fit the bill. Being smart enough to see the deception takes brains and common sense. You have neither. Why do you think 90+% of those on here think you’re an idiot?

          • You do realise that so many congressmen voted for Obamacare that the blll was passed? None of them read it because they have people to do that for them.
            Regulations are made by industry regulators.They are not corrupt for implementing policy. That is their job. Everything was done properly with Obamacare and that is why we have to deal with it properly.

          • Harry Reid had to use what is called the Nuclear option, and the bill was passed by Democrat votes only, with zero Republican support.

            The Nuclear option is the changing of Senate rules so that bills can be passed with a 51 vote count instead of 60.

            0bamacare was not passed under normal conditions… I do not think that the nuclear option had ever been used before in the history of the United States…

            http://www.cnn.com/2013/11/21/politics/nuclear-option-explainer/

            Basically it turns the Senate into a majority rule body, and that is not the way it was designed.

            The Regulators collude with the Politicians, and trade power for laws… This is a form of Communism.

            “The goal of socialism is communism.”
            —-Lenin

            ‘Socialized medicine is the keystone to the arch of the Socialized State.’
            —–Lenin

          • It was passed using reconciliation — a method used for SMALL budget measure. This is a SMALL budget measure?

          • The only folks who didn’t read it were the repubs and ACA was there own idea!!!

            ACA is here to stay. 20 million Americans can see a dr, just like you and I can. That’s the right thing to do. ACA can be tweaked just like bush’s Medicare D was improved not started all over.

          • Again another lie…. Who do you think Pelosi was talking to when she said..

            “We must pass it before we can see what is in it..”?????????

            It certainly wasn’t the Republicans that did not pass it and were ROTFLTAO at Pelosi…

            I don’t think the Democrats in the Senate knew anything about 0bamacare before they thoughtlessly approved it. The Senate Democrats were blind mice being led by the pied piper.

          • are you as stupid as you come off? You called me a name caller and I see your response to another and YOU call him a loser. Isn’t that NAME CALLING? HA HA HA You F’n HIPOCRITE.

          • You are an ignant FOOL and a LIAR Even the bird brained Nancy Pelosi said, “we have to pass it to find out what’s in it”, REMEMBER?

        • Republicans were “Locked out”, “LOCKED OUT” of the room when this heap of $hit was passed. REMEMBER?

          • And what was the reason for that?

          • I don’t presume to know exactly why. However, If you put your thinking cap on, I imagine you could come up with a theory that has a left bias. If I wanted to force something on others, I wouldn’t want anyone to see how the bribery took place either. No matter that you want it to succeed, I’ve never heard anything as idiotic as, “You have to pass it to find out what’s in it”.

          • Remember that guy responsible for putting this crap on paper (Gruber) said” It’s the stupidity of the American people” that enabled it to pass. Therefore, I can conclude that the Dumba$$oc RATS didn’t want any intelligent people in that room, only themselves.

          • It’s a great shame. If both parties could have worked together to make the bill perfect it would have made this country a much safer place to live.

          • To make this country safer ? Close our borders and vet the people we lety in legally. Keep the violent felons in prison for a long time. That’ll solve the safety issue. There’ll be money (That we don’t have to use to house the illegals at $30-$40 thousand each for a year) left to do more to help the infirm. I wonder if any idiot leftist ever thought of that. Research how much California pays annually on “Jailing” illegals.

          • Perhaps it was the desperation of the American people that enabled it to pass.
            I conclude that intelligent people would not spell “Democrats” the way you do.

    • Too bad, ACA is here and it’s not going away.

      • charles johnston

        Wouldn’t bet on it. Obama just lost in court and state exchanges are dropping like flies.

        • Second that!

        • Exchanges are doing just fine in states where governors have a brain and did a state exchange and expanded Medicaid. My state has 10-20 insurance companies on our exchange. You must live in a red state…… Too bad.

          • charles johnston

            More blather and still no actual data. You lose.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Blather? Quite the big word…for you at least.

          • charles johnston

            You should know.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            It’s difficult for you to think straight when your boyfriend’s cock is pumping away in your ass.

          • charles johnston

            And you asked what a gay pride parade was? Aids has eaten what little was left of your small brain. Knew you were gay.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Not familiar with gay pride parades like you seem to be. Check with your boyfriend tonight when your sucking him off. If you taste shit (Santorum) on his shaft, it’s a sure sign you’re both fags.

          • charles johnston

            You so smart little gay boytoy. Tell you what, get a biscuit and see if you can coax yo’ momma out from under the front porch and tell her how smart you are.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Boytoy!?! wow you sure seem to know a lot about all things gay! Impressive. Were able to write that while your partner sucked his kum out of you conservative ass?

          • charles johnston

            You’re the one writing down your gay fantasies, not me.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            No, I’m referring to your gay reality.

          • If you lived in a state wher the gov had a brain your proof is the fact that everyone has health insurance. I win and so do the folks in my state. They can all see a dr.

          • StupidConservativeValues

            Denial runs through every red state.

        • StupidConservativeValues

          You’re wrong about everything.

      • Try Googling Social Security Return on Investment hit www. Heritage site and see how these taxes hurt young black women and men more than it hurts whites. HA HA HA HA You ignorant A$$ wipes are so F’n stupid. Go tell your sux buddies reality Checks and Stupid Cons. Values. HA HA HA Unless you leaches are part of the non working non taxpaying minority PAID voters. You morons make me puke.

        • Actually I watched bush try and put ss on the big board right before the GOP policies crashed the economy. Thank God dems killed it and then Pres Obama cleaned up the rest of the mess repubs crated on 1/20/09.

          • Weren’t you the one asking for info? Or was it one of your surrogates? I gave you the site, now you ignore it? WTF is wrong with you , you uneducated moron? Afraid of the facts and content to LIE on here? Don’t reply till you go to that site for enlightenment. Or are you happy the Dumba$$oc RATS have swindled the blacks, again?

          • Not me, I don’t need anything from you. Facts are on my side.

          • Regardless, you’ve got the info to look it up, you moron. So try and learn something useful and go away you ignant som bee otch.

          • All you know is name calling……red state education, sad.

          • Don’t know when you got in but this started civilly until I was attacked by 4 leftists. I only give em back what they deserve. BTW, I’ve lived in a blue state my entire life, public education up to doctorate. Disgusted at what the Dumba$$oc RATS have done to my state and major city I grew up in. You made a fool of yourself assuming facts not in evidence. Go away.

          • Been here all along watching your factless statements. All you repubs do is call names and swear. Guess what, we will all stop trying to give you all facts and just VOTE in Nov as there aren’t enough of you to screw us again.

          • I don’t screw women with sausage lips and nappy hair that smell like goats and have an a$$ that’s 2 axe handles wide. You lying f’n racist.

      • StupidConservativeValues

        YEA!

    • StupidConservativeValues

      You’re a fucking idiot. “nothing in the US Constitution authorizing the Federal Government to establish health care.” There was nothing in the Constitution authorizing the Federal Government from establishing the Environmental Protection Agency…but Nixon did it anyway. Same with Bush and Homeland Security. wait a minute, they made government bigger! Ummmmm…

      Also, if there is”nothing in the US Constitution authorizing the Federal Government to establish health care,” then conversely there is nothing from keeping the Federal Government from establishing health care. I D I O T !

    • Thank you Bill for sharing your expertise on the Constitution. It is every bit as valuable as all other free legal advice.

      My belief is that SCOTUS is there to review cases referred to it. In doing so it may make an interpretation based on written legislation, or the Constitution, the conventions, or the precedent of previous case outcomes. That decision may well become the rule for future cases that are similar. If legislatures don’t like that outcome, they are free to change it within the limits of their jurisdiction.

      If you don’t like it, tough luck.

    • You are correct . Our problem are the gutless wonders that occupy Congress that could have stopped him . Like Pelosi pass to find out what was in it. McConnell ‘s remark was he didn’t have time to read it. And you are right about Judges that make laws should be run out of town .

    • Nonsense. The Supreme Court judges cases. Mostly appeals.
      Often this involves interpreting legislation and the Constitution. The decisions are based on the law, not the personal opinions or politics of the judges. Their decisions may create precedents which operate like laws but the legislature is free to change them.
      It all works very well and exactly as intended.

      • AND If you believe that these decisions are based on law and not personal opinions, you must believe that I have the deed to the golden state bridge… Which I will gladly sell you for $10.

        The judicial system has become corrupt… Words no longer have meaning.

        When injustice becomes law… Resistance becomes duty,.

        • No. If you don’t understand the integrity of the Supreme Court of the United States then it only means that I should not believe any thing you say

          • Blackmail work for you often? Not going to work on me.

            You only need common sense to believe the things I say… Those without common sense will have trouble believing what I say.

    • What about tied grants from the federal government to the states?

  13. Loving America

    Let’s March On D.C. and Take it Over! Calll Congress and ask them if they would like to help…..that is the Ones who will not go along with Obama!

  14. MuslimLuvChrist

    don’t call this shiite obamacare,
    its SCOTUSCARE OR ROBERTSCARE,

    since they saved it from death at least TWICE!!!

    • And ACA working just fine. Do you have health insurance?……. Thought so. Now 20 million of your fellow Americans can do what you can, see a dr, thank God.

      • MuslimLuvChrist

        you are totally right dh,
        obamacare is the greatest thing that has ever happened to America!!!

        “The CBO’s full accounting of obamacare is $2.6 trillion.
        That’s an accurate analysis of what the bill would cost”, that’s $100,000 per person (now till 2025).
        But the true cost of obamacare will be $10 TRILLION when you factor in
        the cost to the states,
        the cost to individual Americans who are now required to purchase obama-approved health plans (the “Individual Mandate”, like nuns paying for birth control),
        the cost of exploding health insurance premiums,
        the $716 billion obamacare steals from Medicare, and
        the increased cost to businesses of complying with obamacare mandates.

        1 obamacare DECREASES Choice.
        2 obamacare unelected bureaucrats are RESTRICTING your care and dictating what you will pay.
        3 obamacare is Causing a 75% increase in Emergency room visits.
        4 obamacare is Causing a 56% increase in Medicaid.
        5 obamacare is Causing Medical Device Companies to Call it QUITS, due to its $30 billion dollar tax.
        6 obamacare is Causing Doctors to Call it QUITS.
        7 obamacare is Causing Insurance Companies to Call it QUITS.
        8 States including: Minnesota($2,596), Maryland($1,415), Massachusetts($1,373), Vermont($5,439), Oregon($2,704), Hawaii($16,238),… are having massive problems with their obamacare websites, and are closing them down! (GRANTS in $AMOUNTS per INDIVIDUAL)
        9 obamacare is making healthcare LESS Affordable. In 2016, NM BCBS is increasing rates 51.6%, TN BCBS 36.6%, MD BCBS 30.4%, OR MODA 25%.
        10 obamacare is KILLING Employment.
        11 obamacare has destroyed the 40 hr work week forever.

        obamacare is the most disruptive force in the country today!

        you are totally right dh,
        obamacare is the greatest thing that has ever happened to America!!!

      • MuslimLuvChrist

        dh, you have been a very busy little TROLL,

        so far there are over 300 posts with your name on them,

        I hope you are being paid well for your BS!!!

        obamacare is the greatest thing that has ever happened to America!!!

        “The CBO’s full accounting of obamacare is $2.6 trillion.
        That’s an accurate analysis of what the bill would cost”, that’s $100,000 per person (now till 2025).
        But the true cost of obamacare will be $10 TRILLION when you factor in
        the cost to the states,
        the cost to individual Americans who are now required to purchase obama-approved health plans (the “Individual Mandate”, like nuns paying for birth control),
        the cost of exploding health insurance premiums,
        the $716 billion obamacare steals from Medicare, and
        the increased cost to businesses of complying with obamacare mandates.
        1 obamacare DECREASES Choice.
        2 obamacare unelected bureaucrats are RESTRICTING your care and dictating what you will pay.
        3 obamacare is Causing a 75% increase in Emergency room visits.
        4 obamacare is Causing a 56% increase in Medicaid.
        5 obamacare is Causing Medical Device Companies to Call it QUITS, due to its $30 billion dollar tax.
        6 obamacare is Causing Doctors to Call it QUITS.
        7 obamacare is Causing Insurance Companies to Call it QUITS.
        8 States including: Minnesota($2,596), Maryland($1,415), Massachusetts($1,373), Vermont($5,439), Oregon($2,704), Hawaii($16,238),… are having massive problems with their obamacare websites, and are closing them down! (GRANTS in $AMOUNTS per INDIVIDUAL)
        9 obamacare is making healthcare LESS Affordable. In 2016, NM BCBS is increasing rates 51.6%, TN BCBS 36.6%, MD BCBS 30.4%, OR MODA 25%.
        10 obamacare is KILLING Employment.
        11 obamacare has destroyed the 40 hr work week forever.

        obamacare is the most disruptive force in the country today!

        you are totally right TROLL dh,

        obamacare is the greatest thing that has ever happened to America!!!

        • Yes, ACA is great and doing just fine.

          • MuslimLuvChrist

            diane, you have been a very busy little TROLL, also

            so far there are over 300 posts from dh, and just as many from you,

            I hope you are being paid well for your BS!!!

            just do a search on all the stats above, you lazy TROLL,

            or better yet, do us all a favor and just fucking die already!!!

            which is what you will do if you have obamacare!!

  15. Let’s not forget that Jonathan Gruber so proudly announced that Obamacare was passed because of the stupidity of the American people. Let ‘s also not forget Quentin Young’s hand in the design (Young is a 40+ year veteran in the Communist Party USA). You liberal trolls aren’t writing your own thoughts because you don’t have your own thoughts. You’re simply bought and paid for eunuchs of the left.

    • What is your problem? Only you can have health insurance? ACA allows your fellow Americans the ability to see a dr, just like you can.

      • I don’t have a problem. Do you believe the only way for everyone to have health insurance is through socialized medicine? There are other affordable alternatives. Please don’t lecture me on “fellow Americans”. That a big fat ruse. If you cared about your “fellow Americans”, you would run from socialized medicine because it rations medical care. If you did your homework, you would know that. I financially support free health and dental clinics through the private sector, as well as many private sector humanitarian efforts. Do you?

        • Right now ACA is what we have. Yes it needs tweaking but for now I am very glad my “fellow Americans” can see a dr like Y
          you and I can. Congress has had 6 years to do something instead of wasting billions trying to canc coverage and shutting down our government. They have produced zero detail plans.
          My town has sliding scale/free clinics and my local taxes go toward maintaining them plus I am on the non-paying board.

          • What we have now is the precursor to rationed healthcare for the elderly and disabled with the intent of extermination for those who are too costly to make viable. Don’t be a eunuch.

  16. The VA system is already close to socialized medicine, much to the chagrin of most of the vets who are treated at those facilities. Given these examples, Medicare, the VA health system and Obamacare, why in the name of God would you want to give the government another huge program to screw up? Keep the few things that are good about Obamacare, write some protective laws for patients that we have complained about for years and give it back to the free market. Repeal, ABSOLUTELY. Replace with another government-run travesty, NEVER!

  17. I have been saying that for a long time. It is like the repubs want it, as much as the dems.

  18. “my room mate Mary Is getting paid on the internet 98$/hr”…..!jk475etwo days ago grey MacLaren P1 I bought after earning 18,512 Dollars..it was my previous month’s payout..just a little over.17k Dollars Last month..3-5 hours job a day…with weekly payouts..it’s realy the simplest. job I have ever Do.. I Joined This 7 months. ago. and now making over. hourly 87 Dollars…Learn. More right Here !jk475e:➽:➽:➽➽➽➽ http://GlobalSuperJobsReportsEmploymentsEarthGetPay-Hour$98…. .✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸✸::::::!jk475e….,……

  19. As most all “non-liberals” have known and pointed out years ago OvomitCare never was about health care or even insurance. It always was just another version of
    “wealth redistribution” and of the worst kind considering it actually puts peoples lives at risk”. A presidents most important duty is to protect the lives of the countries citizens. Instead., Oblowhard and the democrats (remember not a single Republican voted for the law) decided that if you can’t pay for the unconstitutional law “you can go to hell and die”. With outrageous “deductibles”, most times in excess of $6000 the people that never carried insurance in the first place continue to do what they always did. They go to a hospital emergency room where they can’t be turned away. The bottom line is those people still get totally free health care while everybody else is paying more than three times for their health care with deductibles that are destroying their family economies.

    • Wrong and by the way former Pres Reagan passed the law back in the 80’s to allow ALL can go to any ER in any US state and receive care and not be turned away. And yes, you and I have been paying for that benefit for the last 30 plus years thru a indigent tax added to our employer based health insurance premium.

      If you live in a state that did not do a state exchange you only have 4 health insur options and all 4 have up front high deductiables. If you lived in a state where the governor did a state exchange you would have 10-20 health insur options to chose from and guess what?!!!! A couple of those options are HMO’s which have ZERO up front deductiables. Your choice of premium price and benefit level.

      You must live in a red state……. Too bad.

  20. StupidConservativeValues

    In an interview with Bill Hemmer on Fox ‘News’, Trey Gowdy finally admitted the truth about Benghazi and his bogus committee. This comes on the heels of the Kangaroo Court’s Benghazi Committee’s lead investigator quitting and admitting that everything that could be done, was done.

    One of the primary conspiracy theories swirling around the Benghazi Inquisition has been the notion of a “stand down order,” and whether one was issued. The reason they’ve made this a central point in their witchhunt is to say that the military was ordered to stand down instead of responding.

    You might remember this, from General Jerry Boykin in 2013, when he was conspiring with other right-wing movers and shakers to get the Benghazi committee.

    So I think we’ll see some things that will come out today that will begin to whittle awayat our big question of why no military response.

    Gowdy told Hemmer, “Whether or not they could have gotten there in time, they couldn’t. I don’t think there’s any question about that.”

    Say WHAT? This was supposedly the foundation of the whole “stand-down order” myth! That the military could have gotten there in time to save the day had the evil Secretary Clinton and President Obama called them up into action instead of ordering them to stand down.

    Gowdy is now spinning away from that by asking, “Why could you not? Why were you not positioned to do it?”

    Nice goalpost move, there, bro, but you just shattered one of the reasons your Inquisition exists. Good going, pal.

  21. If you think Obama Care is good read just part of it on pg.117 I b elieve. It also state that there also is no charge to Muslems as they think this is just gambling. Well maybe if we think that also we can get Obama care for free also. This health care situation you need to read as I have on some parts and concerning Muslems they get this as well as a lot of other things free and guess who is having to pay it for them? YOU & I. Thank you Pelosi for screwing all Americans.

    • Obamacare is great. No need to read any page just ask one of your fellow Americans who can now see a dr and can afford diabetic meds or blood pressure pills or breast cancer chemo etc etc etc etc etc etc.

      Thank you Pres Obama and Speaker Pelosi.

  22. Get the gov’t and insurance companies out it. Medical prices went through the roof when insurance companies got involved and now since the 2 largest want to merge where will the competition be. The insurance companies will be able to charge whatever they like. Look at cable the same thing will happen. I pay $400 a month for insurance but I also have to pay the first $2,000 for any care. What is the purpose of medical insurance other than if catastrophic tragedy took place because that is the type of insurance I am paying for.